Those who do or have done their stud service on a service fee arrangment, once the puppies are whelped how soon do you usually receive the remaining stud service fee money owed to you from the bitch owner? We are no longer doing a stud service fee as we have had some not so good experiences, even though it is clearly stated in our contract that has been agreed to and signed. Nice litter born, yet no hurry to pay the stud fee that is due, its disappointing, yet happy to not be doing the service fee breedings any more because of this.

How soon those of you who do the service fee usually get paid your stud fee (minus the service fee) after the litter is whelped?
And to the bitch owners, when do you usually send your stud service fee to the stud owner?

Sometimes we don't get paid until the breeder has to register their litter.

I have had a stud dog owner call and ask for it right away. A day or two after pups are born. Others a couple of weeks when you register the litter. The right away got me. I had just had the new babys a day and always like to get through those first two nights to make sure all is okay. But sent it right away. I have a stud dog also and think 3 weeks is fine to wait, when you are ready to register them. But also got to admit I have only had one person run into hard times when it came to paying up. So I do understand you asking for all up front. I did not like to hear excuses after I had done my part sending my stud dog chill on time.

I did not like to hear excuses after I had done my part sending my stud dog chill on time.
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Exactly!

I registered my litter on line for the first time. apparently the stud dog owner was notified by AKC that the registration had been made, she called and asked if I wanted her to charge my credit card. Not having been on the "other side", I assume that she some how signs off on the registration and could have withheld her sign off had she not been paid?

We did do a service fee which was paid at the time of service, in addition to the stud fee.

A bitch owner cannot register a litter with AKC without the stud owner signing the litter registration. AKC will honor and support the stud owners contract that full payment of the stud fee must be received before they will sign the litter registration.

If the stud dog contract says payment at time of breeding then that's what bitch owners should do. Otherwise, don't use the dog.

Every time I see this thread come up it just makes angry. I can't believe that supposedly "reputable" people are successfully taking this option off the table for those of us who HONOR our obligations.

I have personally and successfully used the service fee method with three breeders. The fee has always been paid shortly in advance of the breeding or at the time of breeding. The remainder has been paid at the time stipulated in the contract or has been verbally agreed upon. I had one who wanted the money at two weeks (firm contract in place) and the other two (whom I had verbal agreements with) wanted it payable at five weeks. Paid them- no problems.

I guess my whole point is this. You get the service........PAY FOR IT!! If you want the respect and understanding of your peers......EARN IT!!! And if you can't afford to breed your dog.....DON'T!!!!!

When you register a litter online, your litter registration is "pending" until the stud owner approves it. The AKC sends an email to the stud owner, then they have to log into AKC and approve or deny the action.

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Replying to:

I registered my litter on line for the first time. apparently the stud dog owner was notified by AKC that the registration had been made, she called and asked if I wanted her to charge my credit card. Not having been on the "other side", I assume that she some how signs off on the registration and could have withheld her sign off had she not been paid?

We did do a service fee which was paid at the time of service, in addition to the stud fee.

Surely nobody should even contemplate breeding a litter unless they have enough cash set aside to pay for the stud fee as soon as the puppies are born and also money available for such emergencies as c-sections, puppy problems etc etc etc? As a stud dog owner I do get a bit annoyed waiting weeks and weeks for people to sell pups so that they can pay my dog's stud fee.

My experience over the years has been mixed. Most people pay within 30 days - when they need a signature on the litter application. Some have paid within a week - one took nearly a year! I have always charged a service fee and collected the rest later. As long as I arranged to take the balance later, how MUCH later is generally not an issue. I just don't sign the application until the fee is paid.

I guess since I am not in the dog "business" and do not depend on my dogs to support me, as long as I get the fee eventually, it's fine with me. Since I agreed to wait any time at all, I never bothered to put a time limit on it. One could certainly put one in the stud contract and then if it is not paid on time nag people like a collection agency, alienate them, make threats, smear their names, etc. I just never felt it was worth all the animosity for a few hundred dollars that was going to be paid eventually anyway. I never figured out what all the hoopla was about and why anyone with a stud should get so irate over it. The people are entrusting their breeding future to my stud dog, so we ALL have a vested interest in the outcome. I would hate for anyone to think my interest is ONLY in the money.

As a bitch owner, I pay as agreed. If I know I will be financially stretched, I may ask to wait until I receive some deposits. If I have the money saved, I generally have paid in about a week when I have a moment to send the papers. If a stud dog owner asked that it be sent within 3 days, I would do that - or breed to a different dog if I couldn't meet the terms. In the long run, there is no ONE way to do it. People, situations, dogs are all different and I think the best arrangement is to be FLEXIBLE and do what is fair for all concerned.

I send my money as soon as my bitch comes into heat. Its plain and simple courtesy.
You cant go to the store and get something without paying for it so why should stud service be any different.
Besides that the stud dog owner also has a job to do.
If you cant pay then you shouldnt be breeding dogs.

A lot of people are doing the $200 breeding plan. The stud dog owner collects the rest later. Why not collect the entire stud fee and RETURN all but $200 if the breeding does not produce the specified number of pups or misses entirely. Of course, the stud dog owner must refund the money very promptly, but that would take care of a lot of problems.

I guess I don't know why this was posted as a reply to my comments on paying the balance of the stud fee when a service fee is charged up front. Can you explain?? If you pay the entire fee at the time the bitch comes in season, then you aren't paying a service fee and later balance. That is what the OP asked about. Did I miss something???

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Replying to:

I send my money as soon as my bitch comes into heat. Its plain and simple courtesy.
You cant go to the store and get something without paying for it so why should stud service be any different.
Besides that the stud dog owner also has a job to do.
If you cant pay then you shouldnt be breeding dogs.

Years ago, as a favor, I took care of 2 stud dogs for a friend. You couldn't pay me enough money to want to do that on a regular basis.

I've been breeding dogs for 30 years. When I call a stud dog owner and arrange to use his semen, I ask what the stud fee and expenses are. When my bitch comes into heat and progesterone tests indicate when the bitch needs to be bred, I send the stud fee; not after she's bred, not after the puppies are born and not when I'm ready to register the litter. I don't get it. Why do some make a stud dog owner wait? I've had bitches miss, I've had small litters, I've had large litters. I never asked the stud dog owner if I had to pay or not, I just sent the money regardless. If you respect others, you'll be respected, too. As long as the semen looks good on arrival, I don't consider it the stud dog's problem if my bitch doesn't get in whelp.

That's our terms, balance before we sign off on the litter.

I think you missed the original question, the poster asked for those that USE the service fee method, how soon after the puppies are born does the stud dog owner ask for the balance.
Just as a note, we have been doing this a long time too. Back in the days of either driving or flying your girl to the stud dog, the accepted practice was paying either upon pick-up or upon the safe arrival of your girl back home, not prior.

Guess I hit the wrong button . As I always seem to do .
Time to check OUT

I wasn't jumping on you, Janet, I just couldn't connect the dots. Were you replying to someone else's post and it just showed up after mine?

"Why not collect the entire stud fee and RETURN all but $200 if the breeding does not produce the specified number of pups or misses entirely. Of course, the stud dog owner must refund the money very promptly, but that would take care of a lot of problems."

Could add problems the other way around, the bitch owner then having to wait for the stud owner to refund the money.

I think trust has to be there. Stud owner trust the bitch owner, and the bitch owner has to trust the stud owner. And then there is always what you have in writing.

Personally, I like the service fee. I send my service fee as soon as the shipment arrives and is checked by my vet before insemination. Balance is sent within days of the puppies arrival when sent with a litter registration for signature. Seems simple to me. I'm sure there will always be those that ruin it for everyone else in the way of trust, so be it, be sure to ensure you know the terms before both parties agree to anything.

Just my two cents worth...

Usually, don't most stud dog owners who do the 'service fee' do this as an up-front partial payment of the stud fee? I haven't ever heard of anyone charging a service fee "in addition to the stud fee."

Even in the "old" days, I never paid a stud fee until the breeding was complete. I will generally travel to the stud 3 times, and after the 3rd breeding, I would pay the check. When shipping semen became common, I would send the stud fee after receiving the final shipment (usually the 2nd).

It seems to me that requiring a service fee up front actually is more protection for the stud owner. If I were to not pay the balance, it is still better than not paying the whole thing.

I am assuming what I am missing is that some stud owners must be requiring full stud fees up front. I've only had one person ever ask me to do this and even though I understood his reasoning and right to do that, I respectfully declined.

to "please explain" - please read the OP post.
You missed the question. The OP was not looking for your personal opinion on how you like to pay, its really irrelevant. What works great for most people may not work for you plus that has nothing to do with the OP question!

"It seems to me that requiring a service fee up front actually is more protection for the stud owner. If I were to not pay the balance, it is still better than not paying the whole thing."
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Paying the full stud fee up front is full protection. How can you even say "at least its better than not receiving anything at all?" It is exactly the reason many have discontinued the service fee option. Payment is not an "option" its required for a service received. Thankfully there are many reputable breeders who honor and respect terms.

After reading the various responses - some on topic and others not so much - I have to say my rule of thumb is reinforced. DON'T DO BUSINESS WITH PEOPLE YOU DON'T TRUST! Whether you collect/pay fees up front or after the litter is born, dealing fairly with others is a matter of trust on both sides. It also requires communication so that everyone knows what is expected and acceptable.

I find that in most business dealings of any sort, any breakdown can be traced to a difference in goals and terms or the unwillingness of one party to honor them. Just an observation from someone who is older than dirt

I guess I should be the one to explain better....

Situation A- Someone ships me semen and then I stiff them for the whole stud fee.

Situation B- Someone ships me semen and I send them a service fee (or visa versa). Then I stiff them for the balance of the stud fee.

It seems to me that situation B is less risk for the stud owner. I think I have been reading posts expressing the feeling that it is risky taking the service fee only at the beginning of the process. I am assuming that their experience is that people are requiring stud fees in full before service is rendered. I am wondering if that is common as it has not been my experience.

What I have experienced for many years on paying the whole thing, the stud fee is due upon services rendered in other words upon receipt of either your bred girl or viable semen you pay the fee.
On service fees, again my experience and what we do, the fee must be paid up front prior to shipping, no fee, no shipment. The balance due after the birth of the babies certainly before registration.

My experience is precisely the same as Gregg's. Therefore, it seems to me that the "service fee" method is actually less risky for stud owners. I think it is more fair for both the stud and bitch owner.

please explain - the OP wasn't asking whether anyone felt which payment method everyone felt was the "best" or anything about "risk". Every breeder has terms that work for them. Period. The OP was asking those who have done service fee, when they normally get payment after whelp, that's all.

"We are no longer doing a stud service fee as we have had some not so good experiences, even though it is clearly stated in our contract that has been agreed to and signed." From the original post.......

Many other posters expressed these same sentiments. Since this doesn't make sense to me, I asked. Sorry. Did I come across as being argumentative or something as 3 posters have pointed the same thing out to me???

The OP was not asking for opinions, OP was asking a fact based question. Every one has their own terms that works for them. What might work well for you, might not work well for someone else.

I have a service fee, 25% of the stud fee, non refundable. In my contract, the balance is expected to be paid within 2 weeks of the whelping.

I will not sign any AKC paperwork until payment is received and check has cleared. I ask for 5 business days for checks to clear.

So if a breeder wants the paperwork to be processed by me and the AKC, it behooves them to send early. If you wait till the 4th week and I need another week for the check to clear, the chances the AKC will get the papers to you by the time the litter goes home is slim to none.

I have some news for you on signing the AKC papers as a stud owner....it's not required!
AKC will register with or without you.
I did not have a problem with a bitch owner, but did not receive the email notice from AKC requesting my "okay".
I told her to have them send it again and she wrote back saying that when she asked AKC, they said, "oh we'll just put it through anyway".
Believe it, or not....
She had already paid me the rest of the stud fee, so I had no reason to decline but I tell you, Gods honest truth, I never signed for it (never got it) and it was put through.

Quote from MP.....

"The OP was not asking for opinions, OP was asking a fact based question. Every one has their own terms that works for them. What might work well for you, might not work well for someone else."

I guess I was just addressing what appeared to me, and other posters, to be the intent of the OP's fact based question.

And I stand by my post. Historically, it has been accepted to pay for services after they are rendered. Maybe things have changed. If the AKC does not honor the requirement for the stud owner sign off on the litter registration app., that would be a BIG DEAL as it is an important protection for stud owners. The idea of a reasonable service fee, up front, is a relatively new concept and is a great compromise for both parties involved. But whatever is agreed upon by the involved parties (whatever works for them), it does suck when people are dishonest, cheap and do not respect agreements.