Help,

owner of 5 month old female lab puppy said her puppy (that she bought from me) had a seizure, and wanted to know if there are any problems in the lines.

I told her there was no problems in these lines. They are top well known bloodlines, and if there was a problem with epilipsy, I am sure that it would be known.

She said " Her seizure was about 45 seconds long. she fell over and was convulsing and foaming at the mouth. her pupils were dialated and front paws were curled up."

Is there any thing that can cause seizures in 5 month old puppies that is not epilipsy?

I have read that certain toxins, Lyme disease, Distemper, head trauma can canse seizures.

Also what test are reccommended to rule out these problems?

By the way, her vet spayed her at 5 months of age. Less than a week, she had a seizure.

Any of the things you mentioned and many more can cause seizures. Seizures are a sign of brain disease. Epilepsy is a repetition of seizures.
I strongly recommend a complete health screen to find out what is wrong with the puppy, and what is irritating that brain, Don't wait until it repeats.
If it does, seizures also produce more brain damage, so they need to be controlled ASAP.
For a 5 month old puppy with all its puppy shots, current heartworm prevention, and no history of trauma, I would think first in a Liver shunt or intoxication.

Check this web site:
http://www.canine-epilepsy.net/basics/basics_index.html

Good luck

Definately have a complete panel done also check to see if she perhaps got into something in the yard or house that could have caused it. With everything in bloom...maybe the owner has something in their yard that they do not realize may be the cause. If it is idiopathic epilepsy it will recur...sometimes not for months but it will happen again.

One of my first show dogs seized at 5 mos. We had complete work up done. Continued as he grew and we had to put him on rimadyl to control.

Just because a line is well known does not mean it does not have epilepsy lurking in it. I think these things are kept quiet. I think you would be surprised.

We adopted a beautiful puppy out to a couple who has 2 small sons. Their puppy started seizuring when he was around 10 months old and has been having them every since and he is now over 3 yrs old. This would be our first case of seizures in pups we have bred. We think we can link it back to a certain dog but it's really hard to pin point where it comes from when other breeders you ask about epilepsy tend to be very quiet about it.

I for one will be so happy when they come up with a genetic test for it. In the mean time, I am trying to get this family to bring their boy to my vet to get his blood drawn and blood drawn on a few of my youngsters out of close relatives to this seizuring boy who I sold to this family then send all the vials into the University Missouri for testing.

A member in my all-breed KC has Corgi's. She had a 10 month old female puppy have a seizure unexpectedly (nothing in the bloodlines she knew of either). Had many tests performed and made many, many phone calls trying to determine if epilepsy was in the pups background - came up negative as far as anyone knew.

More bloodwork and tests done - shipped out to a Washington state university. The vets finally determined that the pup was having reaction (seizures) caused by a topical flea/wormer - the kind you squirt between the shoulders. Don't know the brand name.

Don't know all the details - but that was their final conclusion. The owner has never used that type of product on the bitch again - she is now 3 1/2 yrs old and has never had another seizure.

Could it be something like that?

FWIW

From my understanding, every dog has a seizure threshold - how much does it take to push him over the edge changes from dog to dog. In some dogs it doesn't take much - some sort of stimulation, etc... In many dogs, ingesting poison will do it as well. Some dogs are sensitive to flea/tick medication and will not seize if these meds aren't used. To me, the violent reaction of this puppy would indicate some sort of toxic exposure before I'd automatically say a epileptic seizure.

I remember when my black, intact boy had his 1st seizure 3 years ago, he's now almost 5 and still intact although I don't plan on breeding to him. Of course, it happened at 2:30 a.m. It's very traumatic to dog and owner. I didn't know what was happening and felt so helpless. His seizures are grand mal, ideopathic epilepsy seizures. He's had only 3(that's plenty), and they always occured in the early morning hours. There is nothing in his line but this still happens. He is on a 1xdaily dose of 37-1/2 mg (1-30 mg tab+1 quarter tab)phenobarbital. We upped his does that quarter tab because he still seized on the 30 mg. He has a blood test done every six months to check for any damage to his liver.
There are other meds available. Please consult your vet, this is a life-long commitment. He's doing very well and has his seizures under control. His last one was Jan. '08. Rule out all possibilities of your young dog getting into something in the yard or house. Check Cornell Uni. Vet school's list of toxic plants (very helpful).
Take care.

Absolutely agree that it sounds like a rather violent seizure so do some checking on any chemicals/pesticides/plantes, etc. that the pup may have been exposed to.

You are right, every living thing has a seizure threshold...it becomes a problem when seizures are triggered regularly because of low thresholds. These often require prescriptions to control and in some cases progress as the dog ages. I just want to make the point of not putting your head in the sand about epilepsy. It is in many more pedigrees than you might think.

I am looking forward to the day we have a definative test for this.

Good luck with the pup. Will send good thoughts your way and hope that this is a case that the pup got into something or was exposed to something.

Meant Phenobarb not Rimadyl...geesh...had not had my morning coffee yet when I wrote this!

5 months is very young and epileptic seizures generally do not occur that early. I would look for other causes at this time.

I for one, just sent blood to the University of Missouri for their research. At first, I was skeptical when one of my pups seized. Over time, 2 more of the 9 puppies from his litter had seizures. With 3 out of 9 experiencing seizures, it was undeniable. I was fortunate to be able to send in blood from two of them. One has seizures and one does not. If more people participate, it looks like it will be possible to develop a test to identify carriers.

My friend's lab had a routine health check which included a blood test. Vet said the thyroid levels were a bit low and they opted to put the dog on a thyroid supplement. Dog began having seizures. After all other diagnostic tests were done, the vet decided to reduce the thyroid meds and the seizures stopped.

Some dogs will seize from gluten intollerance. It is the same as Cilliac Disease in humans.

The gluten builds up in the brain (since the body can't break it down) and the seizure is the body's way of ridding itself of the gluten.

Something to look into. You can see info at www.dogtorJ.com

Somewhere on that site is a story of a GSD that was found to have this disorder and once taken off gluten was seizure free.

I pray you get answers for this pup and they can eliminate or control the seizures.

I recently read of giving valium (rectally) to a dog when you suspect a seizure is coming on. This goes for those dogs that get a bit panicked when they feel the seizure coming. The thinking is it keeps the dog calm and I think it can prevent or keep the seizure minor.

May be something to talk with the vet about.

Good luck.

our rescue boy Baby Benjamin started seizures later in life,(2-3 years old) and had sporadic episodes, then to regular episodes, got it under control with pheno , then he started again with seizures. He only in the first two years of having them, had his seizures while crated and well rested, and sleeping.

My understanding is the valium is used to help pull the dog OUT of the seizure rather than preventing it. I would double check with your vet on the valium and when to correctly administor it.

Sorry you are going thru this with your pup. and best of luck to you both.

Patty, you can also give Resque Remedy while they are seizing and it will bring them out of the seizure.