Re: comments about the Madison shows. I was not there nor did I have an entry, I write this strictly as a listener. When you have the majority of the entry it is hard not to be noticed. You pay yoour money and take your chances. To vilify Jen Howard for winning is unfair. I would also like to say that the lady that has been accused of making the original post was sitting at ringside watching the show at the time of the original post. I believe she has also been unfairly vilified. In all honesty, we all think our dogs are the best, but they get beat too. Been there, done that, but there is always another show, another judge and another chance. Let's all move on from this and look forward to the next show.

Cant we all just get along?? Todays weather in Madisonm was beautiful after the storms that were there yesterday, but the rain felt good with the nasty humidity when we began labs at 8am....

Today's winners:

BOB: Ch. Paradoc Delains Scrubbin In
BOS: Ch. Millmar's Truely High Lights
WB: Dicroft Naomi Star
WD/BOW: Beachbrooks Impossible Dream
RWD: Dicroft Vitto
RWB: Belquest All That Sparkle

Congrats to all that did well today!!!!

Jen L

You are trying to diffuse the situation BUT the person in question incriminated themselves by "bad mouthing" the judge, the handler and the dogs on Sat.
This person complained about the many wins of JH and Co from the moment of arriving at the Sat.show.
Using the same words as in the forum message um.........
Unfortunatly, the many people this person complained to were shocked by the comments made.
Also, some of the people just happened to have their dogs shown by JH and were insulted by the unkind complaints. Some just walked away from this person in disgust. They of course told JH and Co and MANY other exhibitors what was said. Strange coincidance?

So let's see now, weren't all but one of these dogs handled by JH & Co? And even that one was handled by another pro.

Wake up, people. You can show your own dogs. If anyone should be blamed for this pitiful situation in which a 2-pt show is won 100% by pro-handlrs, it is the people who hire them. You make a mockery of our sport.

So what your saying is that when you hire a mechanic you hire someone who can fix your car, not halfway get it fixed.... Or a lawyer, etc....

So to say that people who hire handlers make a mockery of the sport?? What planet are you from??!!

Handlers are the ones who get the dogs seen every weekend...

Handlers are just like breeders who eat, sleep, and breath dogs....

Handlers work their asses off to get the job done...

Handlers get paid to do a job and they get it done....

Handlers are more then welcome to help an owner-handler with tips on how to show their own dogs...


If some owner-handlers took the time to clean and train their dogs they might do some winning under the all-breed judges... All-breed judges hate it when they go over a dog and their hands come back dirty... And they also hate it when your dog is totally out of control and not trained... It may be the prettiest dog in the ring but the judge wont put it up if it cant be shown under control...

Dog shows like horse shows and all other sports are very competitive. The harder you work, the overall result is winning. IMO, thats why handlers tend to have an advantage in the ring.

Spend a week with a handler and you will understand what their life in the world of dogs entails (CS)...

Written by a handler, no doubt.

"....Dog shows like horse shows and all other sports are very competitive. The harder you work, the overall result is winning. IMO, thats why handlers tend to have an advantage in the ring...."

You said it, the harder you work, the overall result is SUPPOSE to be winning, but the winning usually goes to the professionals. I remember years ago a breeder, who is now a judge, recommended not bathing your dogs. She didn't bathe hers because Labradors were suppose to have the "look" of just coming out of the field. Handlers have an advantage all right, but it's usually more political than work related.

Nope, no handler here....

Yes, I resent those remarks. What does not having a clean dog have to do with anything. Are you saying those dogs that are blow dry and look like they have open coats are better. Most I know have clean dogs. But the other person is right, we would go to more show if more breeders were there showing the dogs instead of the rich buying championships. There said it. Thats why I love specialtys. Lots of nice breeders showing the dogs they raised. You should have just let the sleeping dog lie.

You don't show horses dirty, nor do you show dogs dirty... sorry - that's just outrageous and an insult to the judge. That includes your deportment inside the ring if you are showing your own dog. Present yourself like you mean business - look at the handlers and see how they present themselves. Some (not all!) owner handlers arrive at a show and exhibit looking like they just came from weeding the garden.

No, I'm not a dog judge, but I have judged my fair share of horse shows and I expected the people and the horses to look like they belonged in the ring.

She didn't bring her dogs to a show covered in mud from the field, she just didn't bathe and blow dry before a show. She felt the Labrador coat didn't need it.

If you think I believe that you are not a handler, you must be a bigger fool than you think I am. If you are not a handler, you have been so brainwashed by handlers that you can't think for yourself anymore.

I do not need you to clean my dog. I do not need you to "present" my dog. I do not need you to train my dog.

And I do not need an AKC championship if it means that I have to hire a handler to get one. The more you tell me that it takes a handler to win, the less the championship means to me.

Wise up, people. If you don't hire them, they won't come and we can have our sport back. It's up to us.
Just say "no" to handlers.

LOL. If this post is directed at me, I am not a handler .. so far from it, it would make you laugh. I show my own dogs .. probably not well, but I do.

HOWEVER.. when I competed in the horse world, I also showed my own horses AS AN AMATEUR. And I beat all the pros... some of the best in the WORLD... And I worked my a** off to be able to do so.

Dogs are no different. I put ALOT of hours into my dogs with the same zeal I did my horses. It's paying off.

OK - but my guys need it ... they roll in the crushed stone riding ring and come up grey coloured )gee.. maybe I could market them as "silver labs", swim in the pond, roll in horse manure, etc. Can't take 'em to shows like that!!

Yes, some of the professional handlers can do a great job at getting their client's dogs to shows every week. They know how to win. They also have been known to chat up judges (on both sides of the ring gates)and give out information on particular dogs.

But there should be more than being clever and "knowing" what it takes to win to have a dog of quality earn a title.

A labrador should not have to be:
Washed, moussed, blow dried and creatively scissored.
Have teeth "fixed to give the appearance of a good bite.
Have tendons snipped to give the appearance of a correct tail.
Be strung up expertly on a tight lead to "improve" movement.
Be given caffein pills to "animate" him in the ring.
Be given sedatives to make him less hyper in the ring.
The list goes on and on.

Absolutely agree with everything you say ... have never done any of those things ... so naive wouldn't even occur to me to do so.

I present my dogs the way God made them ..

Sorry, Clearly Canadian, I was addressing my post to some anonymous poster who responded first to my earlier post and then denied being a handler when I asked.

The reason I started posting about this was the fact that ALL the winning (and reserve) dogs in this small show were shown by handlers. Two days in a row. This is ridiculous and pitiful.

People hire handlers. They don't show up if you don't buy them. They are mercenaries. We don't need them.

Thanks for the clarification..

A labrador should not have to be:
Washed, moussed, blow dried and creatively scissored.
Have teeth "fixed to give the appearance of a good bite.
Have tendons snipped to give the appearance of a correct tail.
Be strung up expertly on a tight lead to "improve" movement.
Be given caffein pills to "animate" him in the ring.
Be given sedatives to make him less hyper in the ring.
The list goes on and on.[/quote]

If you are going to show in my ring, you better have your Labrador washed, clean, and smelling pretty. I don't need to wear a mask to judge your dog or else faint from the smell of stale something or other. Everything else, should not need to be done, needless to say. But, GROSS!!!!!! some of you Lab people show some stinky dogs!

THANK YOU !!!! My point exactly!!

After hearing about all of the chatter on the forum about the Madison, OH shows this weekend, I decided to see for myslef what what being said.
I always knew that this forum was a means for people to post comments and gossip anonymously without being responsible for their words and accusations. I really didn't want to believe, what is the obvious truth. This forum has more lies, jealousy, lack of respect and down right ignorance than I had ever imagined.
I am sitting here thinking about all of the negative comments about me, my employees and the dogs that I show. I was asked if the things that were said insulted or offended me and if I would like the thread removed. I just laughed. I laughed because basically, "JH & Co" was a hot topic on this forum and people are talking negatively about me, when all I am doing is my job. I get paid to present the dogs that we show to the best of my ability. Where the judge points his or her finger is not up to me, nor am I to blame.
If coming home from the dog shows and getting on the forum to bash people, their dogs, judges, handlers and anything else that they can think of...go for it!
If people want to blame "JH & Co" having a good weekend on politics..... then consider this.... "Politics" are a part of every business, organization and sport in this country. Does that then mean that every successful person has politics to thank?? I think not.
I do know that as a professional handler, I do not just walk into the ring at any given show and gather up all of my wins, ribbons and prizes. Myself and my employees bust our butts 24/7, 365 days a year to achieve what success we do have. We are invloved in many of our client's breeding programs, helping them choose stud dogs, grading puppies and anything else that the breeders and owner/handlers do.
And for someone to state that people that hire handlers (like all of my clients) are the ones making a mockery of dog shows is absurd!
Did it ever occur to you to you that you could ask a professional for a handling tip or to get some advice from a professional handler that could maybe give You and your dog an upper hand in the ring? Maybe you could learn something. I learn new things everyday. And for those of you that have such poor opinions about professional handlers, maybe you should consider the fact that every successful person in this world has someone else to thank for their success. I, as a professional have no problem helping someone else. A true professional, in any occupation is not threatened by competition and is always willing to share their knowledge to help others reach their goals.
I care about every aspect of my business I am very proud of the dogs that I show and the work that I do.
I refuse to let some coward get on this forum and take that away from me.
To those of you that spoke in my defense on this thread over the weekend, I thank you.
For those of you that have nothing better to do than come home from the dog shows and get on this forum to gossip and bash people and their dogs, you have my sympathy.
Yes, dogs and dog shows are my passion, just like it is for many others. But dog shows are also my means of making a living. I work hard for what I have accomplished in my little world.
It is sad that so many people have no idea what really matters in life, and what really makes a person successful.
LIFE IS SHORT AND THERE WILL BE ANOTHER DOG SHOW NEXT WEEKEND!

This is in response the dress of some exhibitors. OK, there have been times when I get up to dress for a show, and look really clean and put together. But then I, ME, not my kennel help, has to go out and x the dogs and walk them so they are not crated. I guess I could wear an apron, but honestly who has time to worry about their clothes? My dogs don't go from a crate to an x-pen if if they don't poop, get a match up their butt. I agree we as exhibitors shouldn't look like bag people, but unless I am going to have a dog handed to me to show in the ring, I probably will have mud or slobber on me!! I am not against handlers, they do work very hard, and it's their job. And certainly some are much better than others.

Hey - guess what? I do all that and still dress "professionally" to present my dogs in the ring. And I see many handlers x-ing dogs in between classes, etc. but they still look "together" when they enter the ring.

I was at the Madison Shows all 3 days. I showed my own dog in the BBE classes there. Yes, he did take RWD and I take it as a compliment that someone thought I showed him in a manner that made me appear to be a professional handler. (Perhaps I have read more into the statement that my boy was shown by a handler - I am just trying to find a bright spot in all this negativity.)

No I am not a professional handler nor do I profess to be one (I did not stay at a Holiday Inn the night before. LOL)

I have also seen what has appeared on the forum and the two threads. It is so sad to read all this "venomous verbiage". Jen H is a professional and does a grand job of showing dogs. Her clients have given her some very "cream of the crop" dogs to show. We all have to make a living doing something and it is always great if you enjoy your profession. Taking pride in your work and making your best better is the best advice my father gave me.

As Jen stated in her earlier post "It is sad that so many people have no idea what really matters in life". Go hug your dog(s), take him/her for a romp in the woods or a swim in the pond - enjoy life, love with your whole heart and count your blessings.

Thank you Jen for that very professional post.
You are, as always, a class act.

It boils down to jealousy when someone feels the need to bash others for thier successes, be it the pro in the ring winning or the owner paying them to do so.
People who are threatened by anothers success are people who are feeling their own shortcomings.
This kind of person feels better about themselves if they make others as miserable as they are.
It's a very sad way to be.

I know you are very selective in what dogs you will accept as clients and that shows when we see you in the ring. You bring out some lovely specimins each and every time you walk through that gate!

Kudos to Jen H & Co!!!!

It seems we now live in a society where we think that we are entitled to everything without the work that goes in to it. So and so bought a dog from you know who and so that dog should win just because. Yes handlers do win alot, because they show alot, almost every single show, it's their job and they get paid to do their job. And yes there are good ones and bad ones, but most are pretty darn a ok. I am not a handler, I try to show my own dogs as much as possible, but I have used a handler when the need arose that the judges had liked my dogs but I couldnt' get the time off work.
I think before all the handler bashers start running their mouths to say crap, maybe they should open their mouths and ask the handler if they have any advice, some handling tips, etc. Handlers walk in the ring to win JUST like the rest of us do. We could learn from some of them, IE. a clean dog (not stinking from the farm) and to clean ourselves up, because there is no excuse for wearing your dirty a*& clothes in the ring that you've been pulling weeds in. You have to walk in there looking like you want to win and have the knowledge and handling skills to present the dog to it's strengths. The stand there and free bait and look pretty while it works great for some dogs and some judges love it, it doesn't work for all dogs and can sometimes make the dog look worse than it really is. So maybe all the time you spend Whining about this pro handler or that pro handler taking all the points, you could reevaluate your ring skills as well.

I don't think it gets down to jealousy, there are many people who can afford to buy CH.'s that choose to show their own dogs. What I find unfair, is when truth is spoken about anything on this forum, it's translated into venonmous, jealousy, troll, etc. The truth of the matter is there are alot of beautiful specimans being shown that many times get overlooked, handlers do not get overlooked. Dog showing has turned into more of a game than a hobby. One poster mentioned they have no professional handlers in their country. Why? There must be a reason and probably a good one. I would refer to "shortcomings" (as one of JH's clients called it), not getting in the ring and finishing that beautiful specimen you handed over to a professional.

One poster mentioned they have no professional handlers in their country. Why? There must be a reason and probably a good one.
******************************************************

I think that the main reason is that we don't have the population to support professional handling. We have a number of prople who are employed by individuals to show their dogs, but that is only part of the employment package. The handler usually manages boarding kennels or works as a groomer etc during the week. Our dog shows in this country are generally a weekend affair with the occasional 10 day or so circuit in some areas on the eastern side of the country.

In my home state of Western Australia we have dog shows most weekends with numbers ranging from around 600 to 1200 dogs depending on where the judges hail from.

Jen, your post is a reflection of why you are successful. I am proud to be working with you and call you my friend.

THANK YOU!!!!

All the way to the bank.

you are an angry little elf. you go away now.

the jealousy that some people harbor for the successes of others never ceases to amaze me.

Hey............. Waterberry, it is what it is!!!! People stop being HATERS 8) Team Howard is the BEST!
If people need your services they sure do call. Go win and have a Martini for me!

Successful pros are not stupid - they wouldn't stay in business long if they didn't work every advantage - and believe me, they know them all. The dogs they show are usually entered under judges that will favor them in the ring. It is a vicious circle.

News to Flip Flop Friend...not everyone has good experiences with certain handlers.

Right, when they cant finish the dog on their own the Howards can no matter what.

My apologies, I actually thought the judges were supposed to be looking at the DOGS not the handlers

Have you ever heard of PRESENTATION???
Thats what handlers are PAID to perfect!!

It is ABSOLUTELY about presentation. If you can't take a dog in and have it stand and move to show itself off, taking advantages of its strong points and minimizing the weaknesses, then don't bitch when a handler beats your butt off because they know exactly how to make a dog look its best. They get paid for a reason, and it's not just to stand there and look pretty.... although Jen does a pretty good job of that, too.

Watching Crufts I couldn't help but think how commercialized our dog shows in the US have become. Exhibitors there wore very casual clothes, some looked like it may have been their first time they handled a dog in the ring. I didn't see any pros except ones that flew in from the USA. Presentation? I don't think so, just the best dog put up. It was refreshing to watch, they have not lost the meaning of what dog shows are all about, getting in the ring and having a great time with your dog and "Let the best dog win."

ABSOLUTELY TRUE!!! I wish more people had confidence in their dogs and in themselves. Handlers are UNNECESSARY.

Judges would learn to judge the dog if handlers were not allowed.

Spare me- breeder owner handlers indeed. This sport was formed around the words respect and SPORTSMANSHIP. Anyone who has a show dog is entitled to respect- it doesn't matter if they bred it. They probably RAISED it. It doesn't matter if they hire a professional. A good dog will win. A great dog will win even more. I have shown and have had handlers show for me. I have shown my specials and have had a handler campaign my specials. The dog is good because the dog is good. The egos around the ring seem to be having a problem though. The Howards have busted butt for many years to get where they are. THEY deserve some repect too. No, I have not used their services, but maybe someday I will. Most GOOD professional handlers DO work 7 days a week. It's not all about stepping into the ring in a clean suit for them- they are up at 4 most show mornings, finishing up at 11. Then they have the pleasure of sleeping at some showsite- not always with running water. Then they get home for 2 days and spend that with clients coming and going. The really smart ones shut off their phones for half a day. They spend birthdays, holidays, family time on OUR dogs. Do they deserve respect- YOU BETCHA!!!

If you people cannot offer that respect to ALL those showing, breeding and dedicating their lives to this pastime we call "DOGS", you don't belong in the game. Go home, read a book on sportsmanship, then call your mother and have her repeat all those lessons you missed on respecting others.

Mercenaries fight wars just like the soldiers who have volunteered to fight for their country. Are they equally admirable?

Jen, they're grumpy because you're successful, young, slender and beautiful. They're saying they blame politics, but really, they're griping because they think you win b/c of your appearance. That you beautifully present beautiful dogs and win is only fuel to add to their malcontent.

I have met and spoken with you once. You were gracious, professional, kind, knowledgeable and patient.

There are plenty of overweight, homely, and old handlers. And I don't respect them any more than any other mercenary.

I want to point out something that I did not know and just found out this weekend.
I already knew that the Howards (both of them) are excellent handlers who show and care for some pretty amazing Labs but I now know that they are Lab breeders!
I was not aware of that fact. OK, I am new to this sport- less than two years.
The Howards are into the whole world of Labradors with their hearts not just handling.
By the way, I asked Jen a question about how I was placing the lead on my dog and she suggested a different placement. When I took him into the ring the next time, he showed so much better. Jen took the time to help me!
Kudos to the Howards! Kind ethical people who are a class act!
To the person who started this Madison related bashing, you should be ashamed of yourself. (Whoever you are!)

So basically you have no respect for anyone who works for a living? You must be one of those fine upstanding citizens whose life is subsidized by those of us who *do* work hard.

As a breeder, I would love to show my own dogs. But the
reality is that I am 70 years old, with a pinched
sciatic nerve and a breathing problem. I would probably
fall on my face in the ring. So ,yes ,I use JH & L to
show my dogs and I am grateful that there are handlers
to do so. If not for them, I would not be able to show
the dogs at all. And winning is not automatic, I lose
a lot too.