How many of us know dogs/bitches who have gotten their championships as puppies - but as adults don't qualify for breed standard!

Ethical owners neuter the animal and keep it as a loving pet - however

.....there are those who breed it - and in the crap shoot of breeding might or might not create a puppy from 'Champion' dams or sires who is not a credit to the breed.

Are there are no ethical conscious thoughts about what will happen to the future? What about looking back on the pedigree to analyze where this problem came from and stop it before we ruin the breed.

Some countries have a process in place so that a puppy cannot attain a championship prior to being mature - however we only are concerned about Labradors and they really don't mature until 2-3 years. Should the authority exist to govern other breeds who mature faster?

Your thoughts?????

??? What do you mean "don't qualify for breed standard"? Examples???

Judging is on the day.
Is this another attempt to talk about height?
Or weight?
If the Labrador is healthy, what is your problem?
Some complan that non-typey Labs that are healthy are bred.
Now you complain that champions who may be healthy are bred?
Are you just complaining that folks breed?
Or are you writing an article and want a lot of posts?

I'm curious what you mean by "don't qualify as an adult"?
Are you talking about size because that is the only thing I think that would make the dog non qualifying after reaching maturity, and if that is the case i'd rather see a well put together dog that doesn't meet the height standard being bred from than a dog with structural faults that does make the standard for height. We all know that there are champions out there that don't deserve a championship that got that championship after maturity, bad judges that put up poor examples of the breed.
JMHO
Aloha,
Jackie

Height specifically - Female 18 inches at the withers!

If it is that height for jump height, the weight of the dog, end of the day, fatigue of the dog, position, etc. can all play in. Lower agility weight can lower withers--fat increases height. Maturing dogs in other breeds can suddenly Q after age 3 years, as in Shelties that were once too tall fit standard after an age. Might be cumulative effect of gravity and change in muscling, but it is what it is.

As for real 18 inch girls, they have been in the breed since the beginning. For service dogs, it is good to have some little ones in the gene pool. They fit under bus seats and train seats, etc.

Why are you making this a big deal? How do you even know the height and how accurate that height is?

Having had Labs since the 1970s, I think this breed has bigger issues. Example: Bad temperaments in Labs and ringside gossipers. And no, I don't own an 18 inch girl.

Curious as to how you know she will not produce dogs that are within the standard or assume that the owner of these girls are not taking that into account when planning future litters? I know there are some very important girls back in many of the pedigrees that we see today that would not make the height standard.

Given my choice, I would include a short girl in my program if she otherwise possessed all of the things I needed to improve on. Would you pass up lovely breed type with a nice shoulder, good movement and nice angle because of height? I think there are much more detrimental things for the health of our breed such as correct temperment and soundness.

Sounds to me like someone has been bit by the green-eyed moster.

I have a couple of thoughts on your statement:
Why do you care? If the dog is a tiny bit above or below the standard, a knowledgeable breeder will see that, and breed accordingly. Also, who cares what other countries do? Let them tend to their business, and we will tend to ours. If you think a dog that is a champ is not up to snuff, than don't breed to it! I am going assume you are talking about height, because if you are talking about faults, then show me a dog that doesn't have any.

I'm with Breeder....
Why do you care so much?

This is coming from me...
Unfortunately you sound bitter! You seem to be trying to stir something up that's not there! Go hug your dog.... get happy!

Like with any of our breeding stock they will not clone themselves. Alot of smaller girls have larger pups. Same for stud dogs. May have larger or smaller, just depends on what is back in the pedigee. And why would you care what someone else is doing in their program. I am busy just taking care of my guys.

Why is it the parent club put in the height dq because they didnt like the little dogs winning, and now when you take a nice sized dog in the ring the judges will say, well, it is too big to fit in a boat..................

Agree .. I'm far too busy looking after my bunch to worry about other people's breeding programs, etc. I just want to participate in the knowledge transfer - that's why I'm on here!

Keep teaching us new people please, all of you who have experience .. I for one really appreciate it.

I have a 19 1/2 inch tall girl who I think is very balanced. I'll keep her and breed her. I do NOT like to look at short dogs that are, IMO, very short on leg but with large bodies. Two different looks IMO, and I feel Ok about the first, but not the second. No Labrador Corgies for me, lol!

I wonder how long you have been breeding. I have a bitch that is short by standard but balanced and beautiful otherwise. I bred her carefully to dogs I felt were correct for her offering what I needed to improve on. Guess what, she's produded 3 champions thus far and with any luck, maybe more on the horizon.

I would say she's a credit to the breed!!

The judge judges on what he sees the day of the show.

Wow, what a coincidence, just logged on to this as I wait for a family to come and see one of my chocolate girls, about 14.5 months, who just is too small for my liking. She's from excellent parents, proven on both sides.

Just had her out in the field for a few minutes and my hubby reminded me of another of our breeding who was short on height and produced top winning dogs. But that one was actually a full body on short legs, this little gal is just little all over. And far more balanced than the other female, but balanced for an "apartment sized Lab." I am not placing her because of what she may or may not produce, I am placing her because her body looks about like a 5 month old and I would die if I lost her on the table, during a section, with a belly bull of big pups. Everyone has to make their own decisions and live with the outcome of the decision. I'm not taking a chance on this small gal, she'll make a wonderful little pet.

Oh, and BTW, I could have easily finished her as a puppy, as the other female I mentioned was. Just not something I want to do. Doesn't mean someone else has to decide the same way I do.