If you are reading LQ, and you look at a dogs parentage listed as Ch. Joe Blow X Ch. Mary Contrary, how do you verbally say the X? Do you say X? Or by? Or times?

Dog by Ch. Joe Blow out of Ch. Mary Contrary.

Actually, I don't think you say it out loud at all. Everyone knows what it means. Unless you are coming back from a show & reading the article to the driver, why would you? In that case, I think x works perfectly well.

U.S. Arabian breeders list the Sire first then the Dam - the ad would read Joe and Mary.

European Arab breeders use Dam x Sire - Mary and Joe.

When speaking, if you use the Sire first it is 'out of' the Dam - Joe out of Mary.

If you use the Dam first it is 'by' the Sire - Mary by Joe.

You verbally say "cross".

Ch. Joe Blow, cross, Ch. Mary Contrary

Just a note here - when talking about a male (sire) its "BY" and when talking about a female (dam) its "OUT OF". I hear a lot of people say for example "He's out of Arnold" or "I saw a nice puppy out of him". This is incorrect and should be "by Arnold" and "by him".

Thank you. You're right. *Out of* the bitch (dam) and *by* the stud-dog (sire). I have seen long time breeders state *out of* their stud-dog on their websites or posts on occasion. If long time breeders don't know proper terminology, please don't expect those newer to the breed to. They're being taught incorrectly reading some websites or posts. That's where a good mentor can come in, teaching their mentee's proper wording & spelling about the breed, including this subject and how to spell and use words like temperament, Lyme Disease (not Lymes Disease) and supposed to (instead of the incorrect *suppose to* ) properly.

Don't take my post as criticism please, it's not at all. Especially if English is our 1st language, we should use it properly when referring to the breed we're involved in.

I'm far from the Spelling Police so please don't call me that. I'm also not being critical, I'm trying to be helpful.

I revert to horse terminology by habit ..

By "The Sire" and Out of "The Dam"

Glad to see I'm on the right track !!

Thanks, Val, Sue, and others who are so correct. "X" is short notation for "OUT OF."
How can one remember? Simple biology.
Picture this: whelping puppies and foaling foals don't come OUT OF their sires--literally as well as figuratively. Puppies come out of their dams. Babies come out of mothers. Unless one is a sea horse, then an argument could be made for coming out of both parents!!

...not to mention the infamous "confirmation" substituted for conformation...

Great post, English!

or 'Prelimbs' instead of Prelims.

in addition to prelimbs and confirmation, may I add a few of my favorites

the urinary track (like the bacteria are cross country stars) it is actually urinary tract

and the staff infection... that's the nosocomial one you get from the hospital personnel, the real term is a staph infection

and the old standby Lyme's disease - its not possessive, the correct one is Lyme disease.

An excellent post Emily, also the last poster. I didn't want to be picky, I figured I would leave the rest to you ladies so others can learn.

All of us have something to learn daily throughout our lives. I'm not afraid of constructive criticism and feel good when I learn something new.