I have a 4 year old pregnant girl working on her first litter. She is SO big, she can hardly lay down. 80% of the day for the last 5 days, she just stands around, pants and stares at me like I should be able to help her out. I give her back rubs, tummy rubs and many words of comfort. She's due this weekend, and I am worried that she will be exhausted and not be able to deliver these puppies naturally. I'm not new to whelping litters, just not litters this large. My question is to those of you out there that have had HUGE litters. Should I be worried that she won't be able to push these puppies out? I know there is no way she will be able to reach around and help in any way. They are packed in there like sardines. Thanks for any insight you may offer.

Do you know how many pups to expect???

I would xray your girl so you know what to expect. My girl behaved exactly like this, but only had 6 puppies on the xray, so I knew they were large and there was a possibility of a C-section.
A

I strongly recommend giving vanilla icecream after every 2 or 3 pups to keep energy level and blood sugar up. I have done 2 huge litters, last pup died with both. I will do a section from now on if vet says there are 10 or more.

I would do an x-ray and also contact your vet to let him know you may need him this weekend. If the pups are on the small side, I would think that the whelping may be easier. I have a girl that looked really big, but only had 7 pups. The pups were on the bigger size, but the placentas were large also. She ended up with one stuck and we had to do a c-section.

Do an xray now. Get some small containers of yogurt , and give her one after every baby is born.

Note to self, DO NOT OVERFEED YOUR PREGNANT BITCH .

I agree, an xray is a must, and if the pups are due this weekend, you can definately xray NOW. Also if you paid attention to pre-breeding weight and get a weight at xray, you can also get an idea. My last bitch gained about 20 pounds. We were expecting 10-11. An average 1 pound pup will account for about 2 pounds of weight with fluids etc. We were careful to not overfeed the bitch, and when it was all said and done, we had 11 pups, all born naturally, all survived, and the largest was about 1 oz short of 1 pound. Mom looked huge though, but all went well.

We had 2 litters at the same time last year. Both x-rayed 9 puppies but one bitch was twice the size of the other. Everyone survived, but me. I will never have 2 litters at the same time. 18 puppies, what a nut house. But natural yogurt and honey. They love it and it gives the everything they need for the energy. Healthier than ice cream.

Thank you everyone for your advice. She is on her way to the vet right now for an x-ray and exam by my vet. I will let you all know what is said. Stay tuned!

Here is a good recipe for whelping mothers:

Mother's Pudding:

•1 package Vanilla Pudding (cooked kind)
•1/2 cup sugar
•4 cups milk
•4 egg yolks

Provides a lot of protein and calcium and the bitches love it.


Let us know what the x-rays show!

Johanne

Okay, so here's the news. One vet saw 9 for sure, and another thinks he sees 11, so that's a large litter, but not horrible like I had originally thought. He said the heads looked very normal in size (not too large) so he feels like we should let her progress naturally and wait to see how it goes. I really appreciate all the nice comments, and especially like the recommendations for recipes to keep up her energy level during whelping. I will definitely buy some honey, vanilla ice cream & pudding. One of the 2 of us will really enjoy that for sure! I will post again when we are all done. Thanks again, wish us luck!

Glad you know what you're looking at & can plan ahead which will hopefully help reduce some of the stress too! Hugs to your girl and hope all goes well whether it's natural or C-section.

How about this bulldog who gave birth to 21 puppies..17 surviving puppies nursing duties must be never ending http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/features/mutts/blog/2009/11/bulldog_gives_birth_to_21_pupp.html

Oh boy, I forgot to add that you need to cook the pudding mixture until it thickens! Jeeezzz...

I would do a c-section.

My girl whelped a dozen in 13 hours. Vet told me she had 10 from x-ray. Did lose puppy #11, but she whelped them all naturally on a back to back litter with whelping 9 the prior litter. Just relax....

I am soooo glad you got the xrays. You should feel much better and now you know what too look for in size and how long to wait inbetween pups. I have my fingers crossed. It can get nerve wracking, but nature often does it's job.
Good luck!
A

What is she doing, walking there herself or do you have a livery service for her??
Strange.
Also, what do you mean by "reach around and help"? I really don't know of any bitch that can reach around and assist herself with the whelping??!!
Strange indeed!

Dear Huh? A livery service? Please! Have you never heard of a cell phone, or the ability to e-mail, communicate while on the road? Of course I was with my girl on the way to the vet.

What do you mean by it being "STRANGE" that a bitch would "reach around to help" with her own delivery/whelping? Have you really not ever seen a bitch that will attempt to pull on the umbilical cord to assist her puppy being born, then chew the cord, eat the placenta,and break the sack to free her puppy? How do you think it all began before canines were domesticated? How do you think a bitch was able to whelp in nature without human intervention? A bitch helping with her own whelping, NOT STRANGE!

What is STRANGE is a person who has nothing better to do than try to make nasty comments on a subject for which they are totally ignorant.

I have great respect for the sincere indivuduals on this forum who have given me some valuable information based on their personal experience with whelping large litters. I thank you all for that.

Granted, it was a Newfie (my other breed), but that's what everyone told me to do, relax, and I nearly lost my girl and what turned out to be 11 healthy puppies that were NOT going to come out because she was stretched too far and the uterus could not contract. I think you have to trust your own judgment, no? Dystocia is a real threat and why risk losing puppies?
Ran to the emergency vet at 6 a.m. after being up all night and should have made the decision earlier to prevent her from all the trauma. JMHO.

Safest way for keeping mortality at it;s lowest is a planned C- Section for 3 or less puppies or 8 or more puppies.

"Safest way for keeping mortality at it;s lowest is a planned C- Section for 3 or less puppies or 8 or more puppies."

Is this opinion a consensus from other breeders and veterinarians or is this your opinion? Unfortunately, I have lost puppies with very large litters but I sure would hate to lose my bitch to a c-section.

Opinion of Vets who are Repro Specialists, also Dr. Hutchinson. Too bad there are not records kept on dogs lost at 3am at an Emergency Clinic with a stressed dog needing a C-Section, as they throw in a spay along with the section.

Speaking of Dr. Hutchinson, has anyone else seen the news story about him? Apparently he is being sued for using the wrong semen on a Corgi. She was inseminated with semen from a Great Pyrenese. You can imagine the problems that would cause.

Is this her first litter? I could not imagine doing a c section on a perfectly healthy bitch with normal sized litter.

9 in my opinion is a normal sized litter. The puppies should all be small enough to deliver vaginally.

Does she come from a strong line of whelpers?

makes me really want to go there for my next surgical implant. maybe I'll get Labradoodles!

Stressed - please let us know how the delivery goes. Hope all goes well with your girl and babies.

Had 12 last time. first pup was stuck across cervix. It would have been a disaster if I hadn't opted for a section. Not that many bitches haven't whelped 10-12 with no problems, I just felt she need not go through that and risk losing some. Turns out I would have. In the end all 12 were healthy and she bounced back from the section very quickly.

I had an emergency this past weekend. Ended up at the Emergency Hospital, long story short, they blasted my girl with oxytocin and waited 3+ hours to section her and we lost 5 ot of 7 puppies...Schedule a section with your regular Vet. We were going to do that if she got to her due date and hadn't whelped but she went 2 days early.. Dates by Dr. Hutchinson.

Huge difference in outcome with a planned section versus a emergency c section, at an emergency clinic with Vets and staff that you never met before. 3 or less or 8 or more puppies, I plan a section with my Vet who is experienced with repro work.

My last litter was a planned c-section, planned due to the reasons some of you are saying, to prevent mortality. My vet accidentally left a puppy inside. He is very experienced and has done many sections for me. My bitch got sick and could have died, of course the puppy was dead by the time we realized what happened, almost a week later, the pain my poor bitch went through to get it out. Found out afterwards from talking to other breeders that this is not an uncommon occurrance, even by repro specialists. So don't think that a c-section is without risk, it is major surgery.

A woman I work with has a yellow lab male and lab mix female. The poor little lab mix isn't even a year old and she was accidentally bred to her male. She just had nine puppies in three hours! All puppies doing fine. Parents have no clearances, just a back yard breeding. Go figure.

My standard operating procedure for all litters is to wait for the temperature to drop and inform my repro vet and my regular vet, who is only a few minutes away. I then wait 24 hours. If Mama goes into hard labor and starts having pups, fine- I let the birth happen naturally. If she doesn't and especially if the hour is such that I might end up with an emergency C-section outside of regular office hours, I go to the repro vet, get a progesterone test, and, providing it is under 2.0, do a C-section. If for some reason I can't get to the repro vet 45 minuts away, my regular vet is also aware that he might be needed.

The thing I personally want to avoid at all costs is an emergency C-section after hours. I have lost whole litters that way. I can't imagine my repro vet leaving a puppy inside during a C-section. It just wouldn't happen! On the other hand, I have had puppies born dead long after I thought Mama was done after a natural birth.

"I can't imagine my repro vet leaving a puppy inside during a C-section. It just wouldn't happen!"

Well, thats what everyone else who I spoke to said before it happened to them, including me. It does happen, more than you would think. I have since learned that it is very easy to miss puppies, one person who I know that it happened to after me, who's vet was also a long time repro specialist, said the repro specialist had a whole protocol in place to prevent this from happening, but still missed a puppy. Never say never. But my point is, c-sections, even planned, should not be taken lightly.

Some are asking how I got a litter this size? Well, we did the progesterone testing, she ovulated on her 9th day in heat, we had a chilled shipment sent to arrive 2 days post ovulation, and the collection was poor, so that same day, we hopped in the van and drove 14 hours (one way) to the young healthy stud dog, did one AI on her Ovulation - Plus 3 days, and turned around and drove back home.
PS, she is still miserable, temperature still hasn't dropped, so we are waiting and if nothing by tomorrow, (9 weeks from her ovulation day), we will take her for a C-Section. I really wanted her to have this litter the old fashioned way, but as days pass, and I see her so tired, I know in my heart that she won't be able to do it, and she is my first concern. Thank you all for your comments, I really appreciate it.

Hugs to you & your girl - I feel for both of you right now!

Thank you CM for your positive thoughts.

Good luck to you--there's no medal given for having puppies the "old-fashioned way," in my opnion--you do what is going to result in the best interest of both mother and puppies--the more live healthy puppies and the quicker Mom bounces back, the better, no matter what the choice.

I know of a labrador b*tch that whelped 15 puppies. She had them naturally and without issue. She was so huge that urine squeezed out of her while napping and she didn't even know it. Once they were on the ground another b*tch was brought in to help nurse. They all survived and were all uniform in size.

Several years ago we had a litter of 16, of which 14 survived. They were naturally whelped. We didn't do an xray. In hindsight, we'd do an xray and a c-section. We did bottle feed them to help the mama dog. It was a lot of work but fun too.

We always do xrays now.

How are things going with your girl today???? Hope all is well!

Well, we had 10 very large puppies averaging from 17.5 ounces to 20 ounces, and one very tiny boy who was only 11 ounces. I think the size of the puppies was the reason that I thought there were so many in there.

We ended up with a C-Section yesterday, as her labor never progressed. All alive and healthy, mom's doing fine except for the part where she doesn't clean them at all. That will comes once she's out of pain from the surgery.

Thank you everybody who posted, especially those who suggested the magic recipes. She loved yogurt, honey and ice cream when she was too miserable to eat anything else.

Love a happy ending. Hope Mom and babies contyinue to do well

WAHOOO - that's wonderful news!! Congrats!!

No- your vet is an idiot leaving a pup in there. He is supposed to CHECK that they are all out!

I continue to give about 1 1/2 cups of ice cream twice a day in addition to quality food with a big litter. Ice cream gives calcium, protein and lots of calories for all those pups. It keeps mom's milk supply up and keeps her coat and energy level good. Congratulations!

I've been told that too much dairy - like ice cream is not good.

I've given ice cream for years and don't have problems with with energy level, coat, pup weight gain, etc. Many breeders do not give enough protein to their girl as soon as she is season and so get fewer pups and do not give enough calories to a nursing mom and get pup issues or worn out mom issues.

The only thing I've run into with dairy is it makes some moms a little gassy.

Congrats--those little porkers would probably have just sat there not moving, good decision.