I am breeding one of my bitches for the second time in a few months. Just wanted your opinion on something.

Last time we tested her at 6, 10, and 13 days. 6th day was <.2, 10th day was .9 and 13th day was 6.4. So she ovulated on day 12. We had a nice large litter.

I don't mind doing all the testing, but was wondering if this was your bitch, when would you think about doing the first test this time round? I am thinking about waiting until day 10 or even day 12. What's the highest your progesterone # was and still you had a decent sized litter? I am a little afraid to wait too long as her number might rise quicker this time, but I don't know if that's common or not.

Well, you can do a smear at 7 days and see if she is 100% cornified. If she is I would do the prog., just so you get an idea (if shipping semen) what the timeline looks like and go from there. It's hard to cut back on prog. testing if a weekend is coming up - or a holiday.

With that history, I would start testing on day 9 or 10. This assumes that the other parameters are favorable. Always look out for weekends etc.

Since she was .9 on day 10 isn't it odd that she ovulated two days later, on day 12? I have always thought that ovulation was typically two days after the LH surge, which is around a progesterone of 2.0. I am testing a girl now, she was .95 on Thurs., and we are testing again Monday (couldn't test over the weekend-winter storm), but best guess, she hit 2. on Friday and will hit 5. on Sunday, tomorrow. I didn't think there was much chance of her going any faster, thoughts??? I expect Monday's test to show 5. or higher in which case we will breed on Tuesday. Is it possible that she could ovulate before Sunday, with a .95 on Thurs.?????

But to answer your question, I would be comfortable starting to test your girl around day 9 or 10. You would expect her to rise in a similar manner, but you can't be sure.

It depends on how much are you willing to end up with no puppies. The fact that she was by the books the first time, doesn't mean that she'll be like that each time.

I just got through with a breeding last weekend. My girl was 0.9 on Monday at noon. We checked again on Thursday at noon and she was at 5.1. We did a surgical on Sunday. Now I'm crossing my fingers.

Good luck Jamie, hope the breeding took.

I always do my females at day 6-7, then proceed from there every two days. Usually do three. Once she reaches 2 or over, LH surge, 2 days later ovulation. Natural can occur then if female is willing and again two days later, or if insemination with chilled, two days after ovulation, then again two days later. Even next day would cover. Haven't missed

Well Snarky24, that's why I am asking....I do want the pups, but I don't want to do the tests just for the sake of paying the vet. Like I said, I have no problems doing the tests (and taking weekends and holidays into consideration, last breeding I had the joys of Xmas and New Years to juggle), I just wondered what ya'll thought since she seemed to ovulate later than sooner. I could easily doing day 8 or 9 and then take it from there.

My bitches are almost always ovulating on day 13 or 14. EXCEPT when I depended on it. I waited until day 12 last year on my one girl and lo and behold she was already at 18.9ng! Probably ovulated ~day 9 so since it was to be a shipped/chilled, I missed it. This time, I started testing her at day 7 (as it was a Friday) and she was 0.3ng. On day 11, she was 0.7. On day 14, she was 1.0. On day 17 she was finally 6.1! She was bred by chilled AI on days 19 and 21, and whelped 10. She had just turned 6 yrs old.

Our testing lab is now charging half price after the first test, so it's not quite as painful... Start early and stop worrying about $$$...that's my advice.

Btw, if you had the blood draw for the 6.4 reading late in the day, I'd be willing to bet she hit 5ng earlier that day. The rise is close to 5 per day once it hits 5ng.

Hey, I'm just trying to help here.
Chances are that if you do a PG at 10-11 days and another one at 13-14 days, you should hit the lucky number 5 or a little higher. If you do not want to risk it, then do as you did before when you got a large litter.

You can get a little pocket microscope and look at a drop of her saliva every morning before feed or water (NPO 8-12 hrs before looking). Start testing the first day of heat. I fill her dish and make her wait until she drools to catch the saliva. Take eyepiece off scope, put a drop of saliva on the back of eyepiece (not where your eye goes) with an eye dropper. Let saliva sit, don't spread out, it may have bubbles in it, let dry 30 minutes. Put eyepiece on scope and look.

As estrogen starts to rise you will see a ferning pattern. The amount of ferning you see will increase as estrogen rises. When estrogen peaks the sample will show full ferning or the entire field of view is "ferned" and this is 5 days before ovulation.

The little pocket microscope can be bought at some drugstores or online, they are made to help people get pregnant. The instructions included with most scopes will have pictures of ferning to show you the difference between partial and full ferning.

Once you see ferning you can decide when you want to start progesterone testing. Full ferning is 5 days BEFORE ovulation.

A vet told me once that each cycle of a bitch can theoretically be different and not to assume that she will progress as she did during her previous cycle. Also - I find that as my girls age they ovulate a bit later with each cycle.

What an interesting discussion!

My female just came in and is on day 3 today. I think I will take her to do prog. testing on day 9. I have the male in the same house and he is not showing her any interest at all at this point. Maybe I shold take her when he starts to show her any interest? Doesn´t the males usually know the best when they are ready?

I bred my older bitch on day 15 and 16 for her first litter and on the same days for her second litter.

on the other side of breeding how often do you ck for sperm count and motility in your boys? What if your boy starts shooting blanks, no infection,all tests normal, then what?? just putting some questions out there for thoughts of stud owners.