I was on the AKC website and found some information on DNA for Dual sired litters but I couldn't find who does the DNA on the pups in question. Does AKC have paperwork on DNA that my vet fills out when he draws blood or is this done by cheek swab ?

Does a new stud dog who is a yr old need to be DNA tested if it's his first litter or he is one of the boys in a dual sired litter ?

Thanks in advance

In addition to your question , I would also like to know how many folks actually do "Dual - Sired litters" Is it risky?

Why would you do it? Just curious. TIA.

Because my girl is getting older and I have yet to get anything to keep. There are 2 boys I am interested in, each offering different things I am looking for. I want to retire my girl after this breeding.

Interesting - tks! I'd guess that you'd have to have DNA on both dogs. Good luck with your girl!

So who do you breeders us for DNA testing on your boys or dual sired litters ?

Both parents have to have DNA done, and all the puppies, via a check swab sent to AKC. AKC will send you out the kits. If you pre pay you can save a bit, thinking five dollars a sample ($35 instead of $40 each). I have been told that in most cases most of the puppies will be from the same sire. This was my experience, I dual sired a litter and all the puppies were from the same sire.

The puppies must be permanently ID'd either by chip or tattoo when their DNA is collected. After the DNA profiles are created, you can pay AKC to determine parentage or do it yourself. It's surprisingly easy to identify the sires.

My Vet has done many dual sired litters, including one for me. Through trial and error she is now getting pretty balanced results. The best results are when the two dogs have been collected and/or extended in the same way and the semen is mixed before insemination. For example, if one dog is present and the other has been extended and shipped, she will extend the fresh collection and then mix the two. If she puts the fresh semen in without extending it, the freshly collected dog sires the litter.

She has never had a dual sired litter when frozen is inseminated with either fresh or extended semen.
So it's fresh and fresh, extended and extended or frozen and frozen and in all combinations the sperm is inseminated at the same time. Hope this helps.

what system did you use for your dual sired litter?
in finland, finnish dog breeders had a weekend seminar about this issue, and our number one vet was speaking.
best
ritva

sorry, had i red all i would know.
in finland the specialist also said she used the mixture of both sires and all was entered simultaneously.
best
ritva

The puppies do not have to have permanent ID. The AKC will accept that you have them marked with ribbon, clipped areas, or polish. You just need to list them that way on the DNA appl.

So it sounds like if a bitch is inseminated with frozen (or chilled) semen and then later covered with natural breeding she would not have a dual sired litter? One would have to have the second dog collected and then mix the semen and inseminate them together to get a dual sired litter? Why is that? Is it because the second breeding (natural) would be fresher and those sperm would outswim the inseminated sperm and beat them to the egg or is it something to do with the bitch's body only allowing one dog to fertilize?

Yes, that has been her experience.



In a way. All eggs are released at or near the same time and mature at the same speed so timing matters in that both dogs' sperm be in the uterus when the eggs are ripe.

But, it doesn't take one sperm for fertilization as has been stated on this forum. If only one sperm reached an egg, fertilization would not take place. It takes hundreds of sperm to penetrate a single egg. Sperm have little sticky hats on their heads (one hat per sperm) and when they reach the egg, they hit the egg with their head and leave the little hat on the shell's surface. After enough hats are attached, one of the hats will get in the shell and an instant union (fertilization) takes place. Without sufficient hats on the egg, there is not enough chemical present to break the shell. Once union has taken place no other sperm can unite. If another hat got in at the exact same instant, the chromosomes would not be equal and there would be no development. So once a hat enters the shell it's a done deal. Number of sperm matter (at least 100 million) as does proper sperm structure and vigor.

What her attempts have shown is that by preparing the two dogs' semen in the same way it gives the sperm similar life expectancy. It's also important that the sperm arrive at the eggs at the same time. Even on surgical inseminations where the sperm is deposited right into the uterus and the breeding has been timed for frozen, frozen will lose out to any other type of prepared sperm because it is not as vigorous. So fresh and fresh, chilled and chilled, or frozen and frozen and both dogs at the same time is leveling the playing field.

Thank you for the excellent information!

Another question - If I am doing one final breeding on a bitch and going to do an AI with chilled from an older dog but want to make sure the bitch conceives and so planned to cover her with a natural just in case and then dna test the litter for registration, would it be preferable to wait a few days after the ai to give those first sperm a chance and then do natural as a back up or would that not make any difference?