I have no breeder friends that use premate so I have no one to ask.

What is the reason to use premate instead of progesterone levels? After reading the other questions it sounds confusing and difficult to figure out exactly when to breed or when the bitch is due.

I pay $79, after breeder discount for each progesterone level done thru my Vet's Antech affiliation. I have breeder friends that pay more around here and friends at a distance that pay alot less.

I do at least 3 prog. levels per breeding. A baseline at day 7, others in-between and an extra the day of breeding. I do that so I can chart the progesterone levels for a successful conceptions and so I know the no. of pups born at different levels. The extra level done has helped me with subsequent breedings.

Is the cost savings using premate for someone like me that breeds 1 to 3 litters a year at the most worth it? Or is it best for breeders that plan more litters then I do? TIA for replies from breeders that are knowlegable about premate.

You might want to look at this product
http://www.endocrinetech.biz/products.html
It also is a comparative color-based test, but the colors are related to ng of progesterone so that you can compare it better to a standard laboratory test. It is fast, easy and pretty accurate in my experience.

I heard about that before it came out and was excited for all of us. The breeders that have used it don't have the best ratings. I even saw some negative posts on here. I know Premate works and I wanted information on that product, not a new product that doesn't work rite yet. Thanks anyway, not what I was looking for.

I, personally, and several dozen others that I have talked to have had good success with the product. Maybe they aren't as vocal as those who like to complain Hope you find a product that YOU like to use. Good luck in your search.

http://www.genetrex.net/k9_proges_check.html


Is this the same or a different manufacturer?

Manfacturer is Endocrine Technologies in California. The site I linked is the manufacturer's order site. It is their only consumer product. They make testing reagent sets for use by automated equipment in laboratories - like Antech.

Someone sent me this link about the product you mentioned discussed here. I now remember deciding to stay far away from it due to others color results.

I would rather pay $79 for a progesterone test done by Antech that is accurate. When I want to breed a litter, I'm not looking to play with a product others have not had success with and chance missing because of it.

Premate has good reviews but I need to find out if it's for my size breeding program. This other product doesn't work well so far according to users.

Thank you for your suggestion but it's certainly not what I am willing to take a chance with unless it was for a double blind study.

http://pub12.bravenet.com/forum/static/show.php?usernum=976632990&frmid=4&msgid=816204&cmd=show

Premate is only $6-$10 per test and you can have the results in less than an hour. This is why many breeders use it besides it being very accurate.

Endocrine test is hard to use and more expensive than Premate. Endocrene gives you a printed material to compare colors to but the problem is that the printed material is a different color and shade than the test so its a waste of money as you have no idea when the colors match. Use premate!

I never read the thread you linked. Interesting, but not my experience. I have a good eye for color, but some people are not good with blues. It seems like you have found what works for you and the what you prefer - Antech. Everyone should use what they trust.

I prefer to use the Premate.Because where I live out in the boonies.I can draw my own blood.And not colored blind for the colors. It has been very accurate for me to use.
Nearest vet that knows anything is 80 miles 1 way.But 160 RT adds up for progestrone testing.which doesn't work in my case any way. As I cannot get results back in 24 hrs. Results in 1 wk. So I have no other choice then to use the premate. Or rely on my Males.

As the nose Knows.??

We just had to have a vaginal swab on a b*tch that is in for breeding to see if she is ready or not.She is and got bred.

My original question was about PREMATE. I guess you missed that or didn't understand my question about Prog. levels X Premate given the amount of breedings I do. I would rather pay for Antech then get odd colored results and I have no problem with shades of blue. It sounds like the test does though.

I'm starting to get an education about different testing which is a good thing. I won't use the product you suggested until they get their colors correct. Thanks anyway tho.

Thank you Diane for explaining your experiences with Premate. That must be difficult not to get results back for a lab test for that long. It would make lots of sense for you to use Premate or your boys nose.

I hope you have a vet practice opening closer to your home in the near future for many reasons.

I generally recommend things I like and keep quiet about things I don't. I have tried to be completely neutral here, but did suggest the product because I have used it very successfully. If you only want to know about Premate, here is what I know from personal experience with it. It is difficult to use (for me or my significant other) due to the size of the little wells, takes an hour of carefully measured time for processing, provides ambiguous results and is easy to screw up. I went through a package and never did get a reliable reading on any of the tests. It, also, is a color test, so if you have any problem deciphering shades of color, it is not going to be useful. The instructions do not correlate the color to numeric laboratory results. I compared what I got from the color test to ovulation stages based on actual progesterone readings on three bitches and it was never even close. That is MY experience - clearly some other people love it. YMMV.

Several people suggested at the time that I might have got a bad kit. I contacted the seller about it and she never would return my calls over a period of 2 months. I finally caught her in and she said (and I quote) "If your results are not reliable you aren't smart enough to be using the test." I have a degree that includes courses in biochemistry and pathology, so I have to conclude the problem was with the product, not the process.

The performance of Premate, the difficulty of using it, the time it takes to process and the complete lack of customer support led me to try other products. I stumbled on the Endocrinetech kit from a recommendation on a reproduction research website. It is fast, easy, hard to screw up and very readable for me, my vet, his tech, the repro clinic in another city that I sometimes use and most of the people that have given ME feedback.

I have no agenda here. Use what YOU trust to manage your breeding program. That is what I do. I don't make the product or get anything from recommendations, so you don't need to get testy about it. I just thought I'd pass along that there was an alternative that I preferred. Use it, don't use it - no matter to me or the manufacturer who only markets this product as a service for breeders. Their products are used by many of the largest laboratories in the country to run the endocrine assays that your vet sends off. I think that speaks to their reliability.

I have never used the Biometallics TARGET test, but have heard good things about it. It is also a rapid test like the Endocrinetech one. Someone in one of the posts recommended it and you might like it instead of the Premate. ALL of the tests have a shelf life that may be of concern if you only breed occasionally, so do check that carefully before committing $$$ to any of them. Again, use what fits your situation and what you trust. In the long run, you just have to go with what makes YOU happy - not what others like, dislike or prefer. It is your breeding program and you are in charge.

We did get a bad kit of Date to Mate (Premate)around 4 years ago. I also know of another 2 breeders that had kits from Premate that expired the same as my kit and was from the same batch lot. These 2 other breeders missed a couple of their girls. They were shipping in semen on different stud dogs and one was breeding to a stud dog of her own.

So you can get bad kits or results from any company. I was also told by Premate, that you should draw the blood before they eat or 6 to 7 hours after you feed them, has something to do with fat in the blood. I never knew that and that isn't in the instructions. That really should be included in the instructions.