"The skull and foreface should be on
parallel planes and of approximately
equal length."

This quote is from both the AKC and Canadian Standards. I am trying very hard to understand heads better rather than just relying on what looks good to me. I want to be able to be able to explain why a head looks good or not. As I study heads, I am thinking that this may be a problem for many current labs. Am I right or not seeing things correctly???

The other thing I am having a hard time is with ear sets. Can someone explain to me what a proper ear set is?

thank you!

I am sure you have read the standard but sometimes understanding and visulizing it is two different things.

The Labradors should possess both strength and a gentle expression which reflect the character of the breed. The head is wide and strong but without exaggeration, clean cut andwithout wrinkle.

The head is at its widest between the ears and tapers only slightly to the eyes, and must not give the appearance of being wedge shaped. The skull
may show some median line which disappears
as it moves towards the back skull.

The skull and foreface should be on parallel planes and of approximately equal length. Small, toy-like, snipey muzzles are very incorrect since they render dogs incapable of properly retrieving game. The bridge of the muzzle should be straight. The muzzle is slightly deeper from stop to underjaw than it is
from nose to underjaw.

In other words,when viewed from the side the muzzle
tapers very slightly from stop to tip. The
muzzle should be strong and appear
almost square, with good underjaw. It
should not be long and narrow nor short and stubby.

Ears hang close to the head and are not so large as to appear houndy or so small as to seem out of proportion to the head.
They are medium sized, set well back on the skull, and should be carried close to the head reaching about to the bottom of the jaw line. They will reach to the inside corner of the eye when pulled forward.

When the dog is alert, the inside corner of the top fold of the ears will break almost even with the top of the skull and the fold will have a slightly downward angle.
The fold of the ear should not break above the skull and should not square off the head as in a Rottweiler.

Maybe others can chime in on giving examples of labradors who are ambassadors to the breed.

One dog the comes to mind with holding to the standard is Eng. Ch. Sandylands Mark.

Hope this helps,it is always nice to have great discussion and all can learn something.

Thank you Bluesouth and yes, I hope this turns into a long and positive thread.

I have been having a hard time with the parallel plane aspect but that is because I was wasn't distinguishing between fore and back skull. That was obviously a big problem. The other thing I had to figure out was that a dog needs to have its mouth closed for this. But also, I am not sure many heads I see have parallel planes so am questioning myself. Is there a direct relationship between the amount of stop and whether the planes are parallel?

I just looked up photos of Mark. Let me first say that I have been around long enough to understand that Mark is a pillar of our breed. But, are his head planes parallel? They don't seem to be to me so maybe I am still not getting this right.

The ear set thing still has me confused but your explanation definitely helped. I am getting there!

The photos that I have seen of Mark, his head planes look parallel to me, he had a lovely head.

You are looking for a profile head shot. The top of the skull, and the top of the muzzle should be parallel with the horizon. The stop should be somewhat marked, but the angle of the stop does not affect the planes of the head. Fore and back skull should have the same plane, no matter the width, and weather or not the mouth is open or closed does not affect the planes either. I have a diagram that illustrates head planes, but I don't know how to post images on this forum.

Labrador heads have several important sets of planes
1.Top of skull and top of muzzle are parallel
2.Front of jaw and front of stop are parallel
BOTH sets of planes allows the dog to do the following:
See the mark in all ground cover.
Pick up the object and still have clear vision.
Swim while retrieving and still see and breathe.

The muzzle must taper from skull to nostril so that the water is routed around the head.
The head must be chiseled that when the dog swims, the water goes around the head not gathering up in front of the eyes as this happens with a cheeky headed dog.

Correct planes of the head allow the dog to carry an object, see,swim and breathe all at once.The water moves smoothly around the head at the water line and should have no ripples there.

The ears must be long enough to keep excess water from entering the ear canal , also they must be long enough to protect ears and eyes from thorny burs and brush in the field as the dog retrieves . Another important function is to provide warmth to help maintain body temperature on cold days.

Hope this helps. Maybe someone else can explain better, or if they have a way of putting up a picture to visualize to see the level planes with or without the mouth closed, as it should not make a difference, especailly if a dog is carrying a bird on land or water. I think the best would be a picture of a dog holding a bird swimming, as it would show how the dog can see,breathe and retrieve, and how the water moves around the head and no excess water getting into the eyes.

The last two posters have been saying the "top of the skull". Here is my point of confusion I think. There is a fore skull and a back skull which are not on the same plane. Do you use a plane that is kind of the average or tangent of the two???

The diagram in the Canadian Standard uses the foreskull but the lines they draw are not parallel.
http://www.bclab.com/Standard.pdf

Bluesouth, your explanation of the function of the form is tremendous. Thanks! It is a lot to absorb and requires repeated reading.

I think some of the explainations have been wonderful and well thought out. However, I am more of a visual learner myself. So, I am going to suggest going to a specialty or two. There you can see some of the top dogs, as well as meet their owners. Most long-time breeders are also willing to chat about their dogs, when not rushing to ringside. So, you can approach them and ask their input on what makes a particular head more pleasing than another... There is always some room for interpretation of a standard, but nothing beats getting a good old fashioned hands-on.

Best regards,

Leslee Pope
Huntcrest

Hi Leslee,

Although I am more of a performance person, I attend a specialty or two, and a bunch of all-breed shows, every year as an exhibitor as well as a spectator. My breeder friends are all over the map as to what they believe a good head is. I notice that dogs with many different types of heads are put up. Of course, heads are only a part of what a judge is considering, but certainly an important piece of the puzzle. I am definitely interested in what is proper and not necessarily what is winning. Ideally those two should be the same, and as far as things I understand well such as structure and movement, they sometimes are. I guess I am just trying to engage a larger audience than the breeders I come in contact with regularly.

Having said that, I would be interested in your comments on the sketches that are part of the Canadian Standard (link above)or from other visual aids you might suggest.

thanks

If you could put your email address or email me I have a visual aid I can send you. It is a power point side so, I do not know how to upload it to this site.

I will email you
thanks