Hello everyone,
I need some advice, I had purchased a puppy from a breeder 9 mos ago. When I got him home he was very lethargic and not playing so I phoned the breeder. Long story short I was asked to bring him back so he could be brought to their vet, I did. I was informed the next day the puppy had a heart condition and passed away at the vets office. I was given a replacement puppy a month later-he is now 8 mos old and after a month of not moving right and seeming to be in discomfort when he walked I had him x-rayed-he has bilateral HD that is bad-the vet suggested putting him down as they told me the condition is only going to get worse-the surg is in the thousands to try and fix it.
Is there anything medically that any breeder has found to help to give this boy quality of life?
The breeder I got him from said I could have another puppy-I don't want one more puppy from them.
Thank you for any words of wisdom or advice you can offer as professionals. Our family is heartbroken for the second time

I would ask your vet for a prescription for Adequan injections. There are many joint supplements that he can take orally as well. Given that he is having pain Phycox has been very helpful and it has all of the joint supplements in a chewable form,it's given at a loading dose and then cut down to maintence dose. If you can get him to a therapy clinic and have him swim that would be beneficial, it will keep his muscles in shape to help support his hips but doesn't have the strain of weight bearing. I hope you find some help for your boy.

If he's dysplastic already I sure don't know what would help other than supplements to slow the damage down, but I'm curious-- were the parents OFA'd for hips, elbows and heart?

There is nothing to do for bad genetics, so I don't blame you for not wanting to go back for yet another round.

Take him back to the breeder. Ask the breeder for a new puppy or if he/she could arrange for you to get a puppy from another breeder, given the problems you have been through.

A 3rd puppy from the same breeder? I wouldn't Clara!

Pups mom, check www.offa.org for Hip and Elbow clearances for both parents & their relatives a few generations back and of siblings. If you can't interpret it, come back here and someone will help you.

I would take the pup to an orthopedic specialist to see what that vet feels the prognosis is. Bring the other radiograph xrays also. A GP vet is not always good about placing a pup or dog for hip or elbow xrays. Go to a specialist and ask the breeder to pay for it given the diagnosis your vet has already given.

There are medications that could make his life much less painful and supplements to try to stop arthritis from developing.

The breeder should give you a full refund and part of your medical costs at the least. I don't know why anyone else hasn't mentioned it yet.

If you find out that proper clearances were not done for the diseases your pups have had, well I know what I would do but won't go that far............. Take care of your pup 1st.

Any which way, you deserve a refund and the right to keep the pup, contract or not given what you have been through. If I were the breeder I would be offering it right now and holding your hand through all this.

My heart is breaking for you and your family. Take it 1 step at a time. Go to the orthopedic vet 1st and move from there including some research on www.offa.org, The OFA.

Hey,

Hope your puppy is comfortable.

I have a friend who purchased a German Shepard Dog from a BYB(not that you did) and, you guessed it, at the age of 8 months the dog couldn't move. They xrayed him and he was severely dysplastic on one side, mild on the other.

They were told to take weight off(almost to the point that the dog looked unhealthy) and increase his muscles in the back end with swimming and a regime of walking, 5 minutes one day, 10 the next and so on. At almost 2 years they had femoral head ostectomy surgery at NC State.

The dog is doing great. They still keep him very thin and have to monitor his fooling around time but he is up and down on the couch so I guess that's a good sign!!

These are the unfortunate stories that some breeders need to hear, the pain the animals go through and the worry and financial stress that families go through when things aren't done right.

Anyway, good luck to you and your family. Our prayers for a good outcome are with you.

Remember that the term "hip dysplasia" is a broad descriptive term that covers a variety of malformations of the hip and socket. Hip dysplasia does not necessarily mean that the dog has degenerative changes in the joint or arthritis. The degenerative changes may occur over time as a result of the malformations but, as Eventer notes, a lot can be done to maintain function over time. The Purina study about weight indicated that very low body weight is very helpful in maintaining function over time.

Even two dogs rated as OFA Excellent have a substantial chance of producing offspring with hip dysplasia. On the other hand, even two dogs rated as OFA dysplastic can produce OFA Good. (This is why I no longer use OFA for hip evaluations.) So I don't think you can predict that another puppy from the same breeder would have a problem, though I can understand that you might be gun shy at this point. Life is a pretty risky endeavor and then you die. Kate

Sometimes breeders try as hard as they can and still have disasters. As said before there are products on the market that can help your puppy lead a good life. I find it odd that a vet would suggest you put the puppy down because of HD. Restoring dogs to good health or maintaining them in a comfortable style is what my vet strives for when presented with similar problems. You might try a different vet and see what he/she has to say about your puppy's problem.

On a side note, my neighbor's Lab had HD and Elbow Dysplasia and is living a wonderful life with his family, going camping, moderate play in the yard, going for short walks and even getting a CD. He's slowing down at 11 years and takes an occasional Rimadyl.

If you want to keep your puppy, I would get another opinion. Not that he doesn't have HD but how to manage it.

thank you so far for your kind words and responses.

Breeder won't give any money back, only another puppy which, we have already learned our lesson-twice. Doesn't want this puppy back either, not that I would send him back-he is our baby-I need to help him. Breeder was very cut and dry about the situation-like he is just a "thing" that can be replaced-well he is not-he is part of our family and the kids are heartbroken. I have to go back and actually check all the paperwork to see what hips, etc I was provided. Not that it really matters at this point.
One person responded they would take this further if parents did not have proper certs-can you elaborate. My husband wants to take some action but I do not want to go thru the stress nad I don't think we have a leg to stand on if they are willing to give us another puppy.
Right now I just want to make him comfortable and give him quality of life-he is so very sweet and deserves to be able to play and enjoy life as best he can.
Thanks to all again who take time to help.

May I suggest getting a consultation with a well respected Orthopedic Specialist. Ask what ALL the options are in regards to your boy's comfort. Not every Orthopedist whats to jump right into surgery and will be happy to give recommendations for his care. I'm so glad to hear you are keeping your puppy. A few years back I bought a wonderful boy who turned out to have bilateral ED. It was no one's fault....just unfortunate. Well this boy turned out to be the most wonderful, sweet and gentle soul on the face of the earth.....my canine soulmate. I was so lucky to have had him in my life and I will miss him until we meet again someday. So love and cherrish this boy, keep him comfortable and remember that God put him in your life for a reason. He can and will have a joyful life with good care and lots of love!

Our boy has bilateral ED, had surgery on the worst elbow, he is on supplements, we keep his weight down, he was getting Adequan injections, I have him on Trixysn, with pain meds when he needs them and that's not often. We walk about 1 to 2 miles about 4 to 5 times a week (level walking)and he's fine. He's just over 5 now, happy, healthy, we just keep an eye on him.

Some states have a Puppy Lemon Law. Find out if your state does and act on it.

I did- we are NJ so it only covers up to 6 mos.
But thank you again.
Have others had puppies this young with HD that live fairly normal lives without surgical intervention

you need an advocate. Did your vet fill out the state unfit for sale paperwork? If not have them fill out ASAP. Were you provide the state form notifying you of your right in NJ to sign? If you were not properly notified of your rights you may be entitled to a refund by law. Contact NJCAPSA. Libby will point you in the right direction:

http://www.njcapsa.org

We have a boy who will be 11 in May who has been symptomatic from bilateral HD since the age of 6 months. He has also been having seizures since the age of 4 months. He is medicated for seizures and hasn't had one in almost 3 years and by keeping his weight down and not allowing him to run excessively, he has managed with the HD.
Also have an Golden Retriever who was diagnosed at 7 months with HD. He had gold bead implants done at 9 months and is asymptomatic for the HD. No limping, no signs at all. OFA hip clearances on both sides for several generations with him. Clear hips in the parents, grandparents etc does NOT guarantee the puppy won't have HD.

"Have others had puppies this young with HD that live fairly normal lives without surgical intervention?"
YES! Granted, the puppy was a pet shop reject that came through rescue, rather than being sold. He almost died the first week with severe upper respiratory infection and was obese at the age of 4 months when he first got out of the pet store, where he was too big to lie anything but catty-corner or curled in the cage. HE COULD NOT WALK at all, going everywhere sitting and pulling himself along. My then young son helped me by riding a trike alongside him, squeaking a toy, while I picked up the rear with a towel. Gradually, he was able to walk, then trot and bunny hop. At the age of 7 mos, we investigated total hip replacement and FEO. The surgeon at the Animal Medical Center recommended the total hip, but not until he was done growing. Meanwhile, I took him to a holistic practice. This was in the very early 90s, so when I walked out of there with Glycoflex, vitamins, and minerals, I felt that I had just paid for voodoo. Joke was on us--it helped him immensely. When we took him back to Dr. Thatcher at about 18 months, the head of surgery could barely believe that the "dog with x-rays that make you want to throw up" could run down the hall at the AMC with my son without pain. He took careful notes on what the pup was taking. So this little guy with two bad knees in addition to two bad hips--totally displaced--formed false sockets. Muscle had built up around the joint and held it stable. Dr. Thatcher then recommended that we continue to keep him lean, swimming him when the weather was favorable, and continue with the holistic vet, as the artificial hips were only good for 10 years, and he could outlive them. He said that with luck, medical management could work, and if not, we could always do the surgery. That Lab lived to be 12.5 years old on supplements, living a good life, until he had a mass on his liver that ruptured. Mind you, he lived on one floor, as that was all we had except a basement which was the cat's retreat, and didn't have to climb more than a few steps in and out of the house. Now there are even more things to help, as others have noted. Meanwhile, another rescue did fine for over a decade but now is getting Adequan and hyaluronic acid injections at age 14 years and taking Rimadyl, having gotten agility titles long before they realized that he was dysplastic. At his age, he is not getting surgery.

So also realize that his pain will probably peak around now or now through maybe a year if you do nothing, then he may seem to get better. I don't advise doing nothing--I'd see a good vet, orthopedic and/or rehab vet, and see what can be offered. Keep him lean, and enjoy his Lab temperament. You both deserve a try at this. There is so much more that can be done than 20 years ago. Even over the counter supplements can help immensely if money is a problem.

Let us know how he does.

Can you keep your puppy, get another one from them and sell it? As a breeder, I will give a monetary refund but I know will not. I'm so sorry this happened to you.

To pups mom- any breeder worth their salt would have refunded what you paid so that you could pay for a specialist or therapy, etc.
I have refunded the puppy price to help with surgery on an elbow once. Believe me, I was so happy to have that sweet boy in a loving home that would seek out the help he needed, I was happy to do it. You cannot guarantee any pup will not GET dyplasia of the hips or elbow- there really is no proven reason why it happens- just things that contribute towards it are known. It is more common than we know. There were some good suggestions here, also they are now doing stem cell therapy, I think somewhere in NJ- cost was about $2500 from what I read.Good luck with your pup- you are a good Mom!

There seem to be two issues going on here - the breeder and her input, and the welfare of the puppy.
As far as your puppy goes, I agree with those who have suggested a consultation with an orthopedic vet to develop a protocol for your boy. Your boy may be able to manage very well with supplements and exercise to develop muscles supporting his hips. Glucosamine, chondroitin, MSM, fish oil, and anti inflammatories may help. Your vet should advise you on those.
The other issue is the breeder. What "should" happen is that s/he would be talking to you, offering advise, support, and concern for the puppy. Financial reimbursement would be nice, but the advise, support and concern for the puppy all seem to be lacking in this situation, not to mention any financial reimbursement. In my opinion, his breeder should be ashamed of herself.
All this having been said, I have an adult boy with moderate bilateral HD. He manages quite well with glucosamine w/ MSM, chondroitin, fish oil caps, Trixsyn, buffered aspirin and occasional NSAIDS. The joy he has in his life every day has me convinced that he is doing okay and is happy.
Whoever said this dog has come into your life for a reason is right. Hang in there with him and do your best by him. He is with you for a reason.

Very unfortunate situation. While it's not important now, I wonder why the life affecting heart condition on the first pup was not found when the initial wellness exam was done. I take my pups in at 7 weeks for a check up, and you would think that this breeder would have done that so you wouldn't have to go home with a lethargic pup that immediately died. Red Flag #1.

I know in your shock, taking the replacement pup was natural. And you have said the breeder won't do anything regarding a refund. I am not surprised. He'd be out the price of 2 pups, it's more cost effective for him to give you another later on. But I do feel you are due a refund (nothing over it as I believe that as a dog owner you do have some responsibility to your dogs, they can get sick at any time regardless if it's the breeders "fault"...those costs are yours...I didn't ask for money back when my new pup came home with coccidia and needed medication) but I doubt you will see a refund.

We are torn because part of us feels like we paid for merchandise and we want our due refunds/exchanges because we paid good money for this property. On the other hand, we are bringing a living breathing creature into our lives that becomes one of the family, not so unsimilar from having our own baby.

I certainly don't want to advocate letting ourselves be taken advantage by bad breeders, but now that you have the dog, maybe it's best to just focus on what you can do there...seeing an ortho specialist etc.

Yes that is my focus-money won't make this puppy better or, take away our heartbreak. I just want to do what is best for his quality of life.
I want him to be able to play without pain-every puppy desreves that.
Thank you all for your help

"Have others had puppies this young with HD that live fairly normal lives without surgical intervention"

Yes! When I first started showing in conformation, I had purchased a lovely bitch, both parents OFA Good. Showed her, she placed nicely. Never suspected a thing. At two years old, had her OFAs done, clearly evident to the vet and me looking at xrays they were not going to pass. Felt the right thing to do was send them in anyway, even though we didn't have a contract for a refund or another puppy. Came back OFA Severely Dysplastic (both hips). Breeder offered another puppy (we would keep our girl). I wasn't in a position to take another puppy so soon or even in a year, so I just mentioned that I would prefer when the breeder had another litter, and placed puppies, to consider the puppy that would have been our replacement and just refund half the purchase price when she sold the puppy per se, and it would help offset the cost of the Glycoflex supplement which we were giving. Our girl never needed surgery, she played with the other dogs, was happy. The bunny hop became evident as she aged, but she lived to 12-1/2 years never needing any surgery.

Years later, when I was breeding about 11 years, I produced a puppy with HD (parents OFAd, researched vertical and horizontal pedigree, no red flags.. chalk it up to *rap happens, roll of the dice, etc. No reports of problems in siblings to date.). She was my pick from the litter. I was thankful that I had her and hadn't placed her with someone else. The limp appeared around 7 months old. Xrays taken, didn't send to OFA. Sublaxation and some remodeling was already evident in one hip (yes, i've seen enough xrays), other hip looked ok. Started research on costs of hip replacement as an option down the road. My vet is not knife happy and I was not in a panic as I knew all dogs are different and some can do quite well without surgery, but I wanted to start getting info. My vet did mention that during the growth stage, some dogs exhibit more symptoms with HD and we'd start the monthly shot of Adequan to see how she does. She's doing wonderful now after about 8 months on the Adequan. She did go through the 8 weeks of the weekly shot, now just goes monthly. The limp is not apparent at a walk or trot, but has somewhat the bunny hop when running. She's even back to zooming around the furniture in the living room, and jumps on the sofa again (although we really try to cut that activity short). Will she need the hip replacement one day? I don't know, but no rush to do it right now and I have time to save if it's needed.

This is just a question for the old breeders out there. It seems to me that a lot of vets are really into the new surgical procedures that have been developed in recent years. Surely there were as many, if not more, dysplastic labs produced before now. What did breeders do 20 - 30 years ago? How did the dogs manage?

Our first lab was diagnosed with bilateral dysplasia when whe was 9 months old. This was in the late 70's before the currnt meds were available. We kept her slim and have bufferin as needed as she aged. She lived to be 13 - and other than some mild arthritis,had no major issues. As someone said in an earlier post, a diagnosis of dysplasia doesn't necessarily mean that the dog will be crippled for life

They did just fine, but my vet didn't drive a BMW either.

"had him x-rayed-he has bilateral HD that is bad-the vet suggested putting him down as they told me the condition is only going to get worse"

If I may add one more thought, I'd say to get a copy of the radiograph (xray) and take it with you to seek a second opinion before ever considering doing that. Who knows, the radiograph could be really poor quality and not even have good diagnostic value and better films may need to be shot.

Maybe if you post here the general area where you live, someone might post a referral to a clinic for a second opinion.

Remember there a doctors who finish at the top of their class and those that were at the bottom. Some have more compassion and better bedside manners than others too which I think makes it a lot easier to communicate with them.