Does OFA site not post Pre lims anymore like they use to if done after one year of age ?

Only if you check the box allowing them to post results no matter what they are. Most people do not check that box.

Why not?

Because once you check it, you are obligated to have your results posted. If your dog comes back dysplastic, the results will be there for all to see.

And...that's a bad thing, why?

If the dog comes back dysplastic, you're not going to be breeding him/her, correct? So why hide it? The eventual pet owner is going to know about it and it would be helpful information for all the other breeders wanting to breed into those lines, right?

If you breed dogs that pass hip/elbow clearances, as do their parents and grandparents, and end up producing a dysplastic dog, then I don't think that's a problem. Just bad luck.

If you breed dogs who do NOT pass hip/elbow clearances, or whose parents and grandparents don't pass, and produce a dysplastic dog ~ that's a problem. You were aware going into the deal that there was an increased risk of producing an un-sound animal.

Now, if you keep that un-sound dog for the rest of its life, and don't burden another family with medical expenses for surgeries, supplements, etc. then good for you. Unfortunately, we normally don't learn about the issues until the dog has been a part of the family for a while and they have come to love the dog, despite his/her lameness. Sad for the family.

I don't buy the excuse that someone breeds un-sound dogs because "that's the right dog for my bitch". Puh-leez!!

Our gene pool is full of beautiful, sound, dogs of various pedigrees. Breeding un-sound dogs because the stud dog is close-by, or both are in your backyard (which makes it super-affordable) is a problem and both are flimsy excuses for calling one's self "a responsible breeder".

It's sad and pathetic that so many are afraid of learning/knowing the truth...

That's also kennel blindness. When using your own dogs that don't pass their clearances I feel it's someone that's plain cheap with their money. They would rather use an unsound dog of their own or a co-own then pay a stud fee for a multi generational, orthopedically sound dog.

All of which is pretty silly. Whenever people see a dog with OFA hips & no OFA elbow or visa versa, they assume the dog flunked the missing clearance.

Of course, there are lots of missing elbow clearances because not everyone used to do elbows. And then there is PennHIP. Those scores don't go up automatically and a dog with a super PennHIP score might skip OFA hip x-rays & not bother to ante up the extra $'s to put that on the database.

In the final analysis, you might just as well post all results. Otherwise people will assume or they will ask. And if they ask, you'd have to fess up anyway.

This thread is precisely why people don't post. Because they do not need the agravation caused . The assumptions and negativity is too much to deal with.

Don't post - don't have the crap. Post hips only, people spread lies.

The time some will *fess up* as you call it is if another breeder inquires about the ratings on OFA and is looking to breed to that dog.

I am *so* tired of seeing OFA Hips Good, OFA Elbows normal, OFA Echo Cardiac clear, OFA EIC clear, OFA CNM Clear and CERF on websites. Then I go to double check it on OFA before contacting the breeder, there is not 1 clearance listed. This could be Prelims or finals. I make sure the name is spelled absolutely right by the breeder and other Google searches. I even try just the kennel name, no dog listed with that name. I go back again 2 weeks later middle of pedigree and clearance research, there is still nothing. No scanned documents on the website either.

I move on and ultimately use the best dog that has all of his clearances that I feel could be right for my girl. I don't want to have to ask why it's *ALL* not on OFA. I shouldn't have to ask if all of the clearances say *OFA* before the clearance name. If it says OFA this, that or the other thing, then dang it, it should be there. The same as CERF. An ACVO exam is not a CERF until the form is sent to CERF. If it doesn't go to CERF it's an ACVO exam. What's the big deal sending in to CERF to have an actual CERF? If it isn't sent in, then state ACVO exam clear, don't call it a CERF.

After I do my breeding I sometimes go back 2 or 3 mo.'s later out of curiousity. It's still not on offa.org. Then, I'm happy I didn't inquire with that stud dog owner b/c something isn't right.

I'm not picking on the boys, I see as many girls with the same prelim or final supposed clearances. I'm just not as interested in the girls unless they're relatives of a dog I'm considering using for stud service.

Why can't it all be taken care of before it's listed on a website? Am I the only breeder that finds this frustrating at the least and questions the clearances that don't appear on OFA by particular breeders?

It seems the longer time breeders I know, handle it right ..... the majority of them anyway. Please don't tell me to contact the breeder. I really don't want to hear a story.

Did not mean to start all this fuss. Last time I did a pre lim it appeared on the site. Did not even see something to sign. Who cares I have the paper work.

I know quite a few "reputable" breeders without elbows done on some of their commonly bred bitches. Why? I don't know. I trust them though so I don't talk about them behind their backs.

Why not post prelims? None of your business is the way I feel. Prelims are for me to decide what I want to do with my dog. I am not the breeder breeding my male back to back to back as the new flavor of the month. MY dog's prelims are none of your business until I am ready to do finals, make them public or offer my boy for stud.

I like the camaraderie that we can build through the internet but I am tired of the know it alls and the "I'm doing it right and you're doing it wrong" folks.

I agree with the fact that my dogs' prelims are no one's business but mine. I haven't and won't post mine. I've had some prelims done on boys (for my curiosity), then I've had people ask me if their prelims are done so they can breed to them. I don't offer my boys before finals to avoid headaches later. In the end, prelims don't mean squat. It's the finals that count. I've always said no, that my boys don't have prelims, and that they could contact me again after finals.

I do prelims for two reasons...
1) if the hips/elbows are bad I will spay/neuter and place into a pet home before I get more attached and my dreams of future generations get too big
2) if the hips/elbows are bad on a beautiful show prospect I want to know before spending a lot of money in puppy sweeps and showing.

My reasons are for me. Not for stud services, not for the public. If I'm out showing a pup who is over 12 months and under 2 years, prelims came back good.

Although that is no one's business but my own. :-)