There have been several posts on this board recently about Southeastern Guide Dogs (SEGD), including a few with responses by me and others. Rather than respond to every post and be perceived as spamming the board, I thought I would post one message to try to put all relevant information in one place.

First, for those who want to know more about SEGD, I recommend visiting our site at www.guidedogs.org. A few quick facts: SEGD is a 501(c)(3) non-profit organization whose primary mission is to train dogs to assist the visually impaired. Located in Palmetto, Florida, SEGD is one of only 10 guide dog schools in the U.S. accredited by the International Guide Dog Federation, and the only one in the southeastern United States. SEGD receives no government funding and relies completely on the generosity of its supporters. SEGD provides trained guide dogs to its students free of charge and has been giving the visually impaired the gift of freedom, independence, and mobility since 1982.

Because it takes a special type of dog to be a guide dog, SEGD breeds its own dogs. SEGD has recently embarked on a program to enhance its breeding stock by contacting outside breeders to find exceptional puppies to purchase, in hopes that they will grow into adult dogs who have what it takes to produce successful guide dog candidates. Health, temperament, and trainability are the most important selection criteria; color is not important.

Two people from SEGD are making primary contacts with breeders of Labrador retrievers, one of which is me. (A third SEGD person is looking for golden retrievers.) I am a volunteer puppy raiser and breeder host for SEGD. As it happens, I have a particular fondness for chocolate Labs, a color that is mostly absent from SEGD's program. Breeders who have heard from me have heard me inquire about chocolates. Though SEGD does not care about color, it is my personal mission to find, purchase, and donate to SEGD qualified chocolate Labs, including the next puppy I will raise. In the interest of helping SEGD find qualified puppies of any color, I may also inquire about yellows and blacks.

To those who wonder why we don't stick to breeders in Florida, the simple answer is that we are not finding what we need. Breeders whose dogs pass all the health clearances (good hips, elbows, current CERF, PRA, cardiac, and EIC) and who are willing to freely share the medical histories in their lines are few and far between -- and those few are often skeptical about having one of their puppies become a breeder for us. (I admit I cannot comprehend why any breeder would not welcome the opportunity to see one of her pups have a positive impact on countless lives in need, but it happens.)

If you've looked for an exceptional puppy of your own recently, perhaps you will understand just how difficult they are to find. Now imagine what the task would be like if you didn't have lots of connections within the dog breeding world, and you get a better picture of the challenge we face. It would be nice if we could just search Google for "reputable breeders willing to sell to guide dog schools," but alas, it's not that easy, so we spend countless hours looking for and vetting possible breeders in a sincere effort to find great dogs for our program.

I hope this gives everyone a better idea of who Southeastern Guide Dogs is and why we might be contacting you. More importantly, I hope this encourages the most conscientious breeders to work with us so that we can continue changing lives one dog at a time.

- John Bauer, Puppy Raiser and Breeder Host, Southeastern Guide Dogs

As someone sympathetic to the plight of those seeking service dog candidates, I appreciate the difficulties stated in your clear post.

I understand why a training program to provide service dogs might need their own breeding program. Nature is important to success. And many training programs do seem to be seeking to breed their own puppies.

But nature is only part of the story. In discussions with trainers and service dog programs over the years, it appears to me that a great many dogs have not finished their training because of holes in the training program. Some programs seem to have better finish rates than others. What percentage of dogs who enter your program have graduated in the last 10 years from your training program to successfully provide service?

I was contacted by this Southeastern Guide Dogs. It seems they are only looking for PRA Clear and EIC Clear dogs or pups. As we have some girls that are PRA Carriers and some that are EIC Carriers, I guess they are not interested because I never heard back after I said that. So that is really helping them with narrowing their search even more. Not every breeder is EIC testing. I can't for the live of me figure out why they are passing up or turning out PRA carriers or EIC carries, when they only carry the gene and are not affected. Maybe the don't want to introduce those genes into the lines but its something they could breed out down the road. This was only said after I asked if they PRA and EIC test, because they only asked about Hips, Elbows, Eyes and Heart clearances in the original email.

That is strange. Would think they would like any nice pup to train for a guide dog. Carriers should be fine. Sounds like wanting to breed more than train. Their are others who are in to that. Breeding their own, just makes you wonder. Service dogs. Now they are asking for certain things and colors. Strange to me.

How many litters do your breeders have? I heard 6, possibly more.

The only explanation is that they do not want to spend money on any further testing.

Ouch, don't like that term, become a breeder. Does not sound like a good life. Sorry.

Some guide and service dog training organizations have high nonfinish rates among the dogs they train. They may start with a lot of dogs before they get one that finishes the training successfully.

The organizations also need to find homes for the dogs who do not complete the training. So these organizations need to produce not only successful dogs but dogs they can easily place in pet homes.

Before you donate or sell a dog to a service organization find out their training success rate.

Annually, we are on the high end of the industry standard range of 30-40% guide dog placement. We make 70 matches per year. This is not to say that 60-70% of our dogs “flunk.” We’ve placed 10 veteran assistance dogs this year, and since it’s a new program, we expect that number will rise next year. We have a Canine Connections program where the dog is placed as a companion (not service dog) to a blind child, so they can learn about caring for a dog and be prepared for when they might get their own guide dog. We’ve had dogs become companions for autistic children and dogs who go into our ambassador program as therapy dogs. We’ve also worked closely over the years with bomb-and-arson, narcotics detection, and search-and-rescue groups; we call them when we think we might have a candidate for them (usually a more driven dog).

In addition to our breeding program goals, we are constantly looking for ways to improve our success rate via improvements in the entire training process, from early socialization to puppy raising to guide dog training. Breeding is certainly not the only important factor in making a guide dog, but it provides an important foundation.

These tests are an added expense that SEGD would prefer to avoid, but we are certainly aware of how few "clear" litters are produced and will consider possible carriers. FWIW, Heather has been contacted.

I don't understand "wanting to breed more than train," but virtually every major guide dog school in the U.S. as well as other service dog organizations breed their own puppies. Just as show or field breeders want to develop certain consistent traits in their dogs, so too do organizations producing guide dogs. Asking for health clearances seems reasonable to me, as many "nice pups" have had hip or elbow dysplasia, for example. And if I did not make it clear before, let me reiterate: SEGD does not care about color. I must admit, it saddens me to read (here and elsewhere) such unfounded suspicion of our organization.

We breed our females 3 to 4 times if we can, though, for example, the two breeders I raised only had one litter each.

Our breeders seem to have pretty good lives, living as pets with their host families. The bitch I host loves her visits to SEGD to play with the other dogs and kennel staff.

When a dog doesn't make it in your training program but you think it would work well in another organization's program (like bomb detection work), do you donate to that other organization or sell them the dog?

John, Thank you for your detailed and well-written answer to my question. I hope you're willing to answer just a few more questions.

What percentage of the dogs who are bred for service (guiding the blind as well as your other programs) find jobs as service providers? What percentage are placed in pet homes? How do you find pet homes for the dogs who do not graduate into service and for the breeding stock after they have finished breeding?

Can you discuss a bit about the type of training that is used to train guide dogs? I have not found a guide dog program with a training program entirely compatible with my training philosophy and the available research about dog training--though I have found many more general service dog organizations with whom I am compatible. Many of the guide dog organizations have seemed to lag behind the service dog organizations in implementing positive reinforcement strategies of training. And most of the guide dog organizations have a much lower success rate in placing dogs for service than the general service dog organizations.

At what age do potential candidates for guide dog training enter the training program? What is the process of puppy rearing and socialization that you use until training is started? How do you screen puppy raisers? What happens to the dogs who have health problems that prevent them from entering service?

As you may perceive, I am very particular about donations to service dog organizations. I want to assure not only that breeding stock will have good lives but also that their offspring will have good lives. My questions are not intended to cast suspicion on your organization; they are the questions I ask all service dog organizations. As a psychologist and trainer myself, the quality of the training used is very important to me.

I am more than happy to answer whatever questions I can. I think in this case the answers could fill a book. :)

To start with, *all* SEGD dogs are bred with the goal of them becoming guide dogs (or breeders of guide dogs). It is only after guide dog work is ruled out for a dog that other "careers" are considered. I don't know what percentage of SEGD dogs end up in service careers, but even that can be hard to pin down. Is therapy work service? Many Southeastern dogs who go to pet homes become therapy dogs. Is companionship for a blind child service? Or is service narrowly defined as covered by ADA (which would rule out, e.g., search and rescue)? I'm not sure anyone at SEGD would even know how many of their dogs become strictly pets. People attracted to SEGD often want to do more with their dogs. I know that as much as I loved my pet dog Hershey (guess what color), when he died, I only wanted dogs in my life that served a larger purpose than being my pet, which is why I became a puppy raiser.

A good number of pet adoptions go to the families who raised the puppies. Anyone in the general public wanting a SEGD dog as a pet goes through the public adoption process -- which basically involves filling out an application, being interviewed, and spending time on campus with the dog to see if it's a good match. Virtually 100% of breeder host families adopt the breeder dogs (male and female) they've been hosting once the dogs are retired.

Training is chiefly accomplished through praise and leash corrections -- effusive positive reinforcement when the dog is producing the correct behavior, or a quick leash "pop" on a training collar (standard choke chain) to let the dog know its behavior is not what is desired. This is the general method used by both puppy raisers (after pups are 6 months old) and SEGD trainers. Clicker training with treats is also used by the trainers during a portion of the training process.

To your point that guide dog organizations have lower success rates than other organizations, I would suggest that's probably because guide dog work is much more difficult for a dog to master. Dogs do many amazing things for people, but I can't think of anything that compares with being able to safely guide a blind person virtually anywhere they need to go.

Though it can vary, dogs are generally turned in by their puppy raisers to begin their guide dog training at about 14-16 months old. From 9 weeks old until they go in for training, the puppies are entrusted to volunteer puppy raisers who care for the dogs, teach them basic obedience and house manners, and take them to as many places as possible to try to expose the dogs to as many situations as possible so they are confident wherever they may find themselves. Puppy raisers fill out an application, are invited to attend a few meetings of their local puppy raiser group where their dog handling skills might be assessed, and undergo a home visit and interview by the group's area coordinator. The outlines and expectations of the program are fully explained and must be agreed to. If the puppy raiser is approved, s/he goes on a waiting list for a puppy and may be given opportunities to puppysit in the meantime to better understand the nature of the puppy raising experience. Puppy raisers have a training manual to follow and meet twice a month with their group so their progress can be monitored and guidance received. Puppy raisers also periodically fill out evaluation forms about their pups.

Dogs with health problems that prevent them from having careers are adopted out as pets using the same process described above.

I hope I covered everything, but feel free to post followups.

We donate the dog.