school refusers


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School Refusal
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what do we do now!

Just had a phone call from Social Services after being referred to them by the police a couple of weeks ago after an incident where my husband got accidentally concussed after DD had a violent outburst. Social services were saying that CAMH's want us to attend as many sessions as possible to assess our family's needs. They need to see and talk to DD to do this. We have been trying to get her to these sessions since last March but she re fusses to go. We go down the route of banning xbox, computer ect, as a consequence of not going and still we are in the same situation. Me stuck at home unable to go back to work as need to look after daughter who goes to school for about 10% of her timetable, she will not leave the house to travel to the CAMH's sessions, she is continually scared of feeling sick and not being able to deal with that as well as separation anxiety. Not going out as a family anywhere, because of DD's issues, husband working all hours to earn a wage and keep roof over our heads. how dreadful does our family situation have to be, how are we going to get DD to the sessions, do we go back to violent, destructive, abusive behavior from her that just destroy's our family. I just do not know what to do!!!!!

HELP my wise friends,

Re: what do we do now!

Have you contacted Young minds for advice on what CAMHS could do to make it easier or suggest other ways of dealing with her violent outbusts, they have psychologist you can talk to for free advice. They will call you within back in 7 days its usually quicker than that. its a really helpful service i used them to check up on what cahms should or not be doing and ideas. In the meantime checkout their website - you may need support yourself to help cope with this situation

Re: what do we do now!

Hi

Ask Cahms to come to you. They did for us when we were involved them first time round.

Hang in there

Sue

Re: what do we do now!

I am not feeling at all wise, but am feeling distressed at your predicament.

I think that the police have to be involved if there is a head injury - or so we were told in similar circumstances. So not to worry too much there.

Keeping your daughter connected with the outside world is important, so banning communication tools is not always the best answer. I recall taking away my daughter's laptop only to discover her teacher was trying to get in touch by email! However, my point is that you want her to maintain contact with friends that might be supportive in school.

I have been wondering about the separation issue, and how best to overcome this. Most of us fight this battle on our own, but if we were to involve friends who could come into the house allowing us to escape - might that help break that cycle?

I expect that you are walking on egg shells trying to keep things calm whilst at the same time attempting to impose boundaries to bring your daughter back to a more normal lifestyle. All this is totally exhausting.

So my thoughts are with you at this time,

Simon.

Re: what do we do now!

Thank you so much for you considered responses to our situation.
Simon I agree with you about banning stuff that connect her to the outside world, so she now has a system where she goes out for a drive in the car further and further each time very tiny steps then this helps her to earn tokens that she can exchange for time on the laptop or xbox, as well as doing chores around the house to earn tokens too. We do tend to run out of consequences as grounding her isn't possible as she does not go out anyway.
The idea of inviting friends in is a good one to help when I want to go out and we are working slowly on me popping out for longer and longer periods of time and dad or nan etc being at home. This has improved over the last week or so as I went shopping for an hour yesterday and she hardly noticed.
Tracey thanks for the reminder about Young Minds, I am waiting for a telephone call from a councilor within the next few days and have a big long list of questions for them.
Sue, thanks for the info on CAMH's, they are very reluctant to come to us for any kind of support they expect us to go to them, for Kool Kids program in March and now family counselling neither of which DD can get to successfully and so she is not able to access the support CAHM's can give.
We have just had a letter asking us to attend Family Counseling with or without DD which is fine but then we have to find ways of getting some of the family there of course we do our best but sometimes there is a blip in the grand plan.
Lots of help for the family in one form or another but still a very frightened girl trying to deal with all the anxieties about school, travelling away form home, being away from me now she has a worry over planes crashing into the house! but she is doing her best but the rest of us being impatient with the slow and sometimes backward steps the emergence of new anxieties and heightened emotional state when any type of pressure or expectation of change in behavior or thoughts is suggested by us.
Thanks again guys, got my more rational head on now.
Good luck with all your struggles and a big thumbs up form me to you all

Re: what do we do now!

Hi

Just read your message today - gosh things are tough going but so glad to hear that by your second post you were feeling a bit more on top of things. Simon, Sue and Tracey have offered some good support here.
I would also agree that taking away the technology can result in isolating our kids even further.
I also found with my son that rewards never worked - he felt so bad, he just didn't care. That doesn't mean to say rewards and consequences aren't good to go with for some but they don't work with all.
For my son a certain maturity and acceptance on his part was one turning point - my acceptance much earlier had been an earlier step forward - and now with medication things have improved.
Its not all smooth - we have had a couple of bad days just lately - but overall - much improved. So have lots of hope because things will move forward.
It must be so wearing for you listening to all that irrational talk from your daughter. If she can get the right help and some cognitive behaviour therapy to change her negative thought patterns she will take steps forward.
HOpe you can find the help you need as soon as possible.
Are you able to seek help privately? I get the impression CAMHS are just so different depending on where you are and which team you have -that sometimes you have to try and seek help outside of that system. A referral from your GP perhaps?
Take care and let us know how you are getting along. And can you take up a hobby or on-line study yourself from home to stop you feeling so tied to your daughter? Or as Simon suggested - get a friend to come round and go out and take a class or have coffee with other friends (rotation of friends). Going out to do the shopping frequently could get her used to you being away for longer and longer.
I can't remember whether you have told us whether your daughter has had a diagnosis yet? Sounds like lots of anxieties going on apart from the separation.
Take care - we are thinking of you at this hard time
Linda xx

Re: what do we do now!

The only relief we have had at all is from medicine. My son refuses to take part in therapy. It's not that he is rude or defiant to the therapists but he just won't practice what they try to teach him. Therapy makes his feel bad and all he wants is relief.

I have little hope for my child ever being independent. I hope this feeling goes away and that he eventually gets better but after three years of struggle we have made no progress. He is aware of this too and it contributes to his hopelessness. He is only 15. Perhaps he will mature out of this but what we are doing isn't helping much. We just can't make him someone he isn't. My wife thinks this is mostly a problem of discipline. Everything squabble gets escalated into a test of wills. Taking away of electronics, getting out of bed at a reasonable hour, chores. All of it is a battle.

Re: what do we do now!

Terskac - I wonder if at 15 you are also coping with typical teenage behaviour on top of the mental health?
My son too creates such a struggle over going to bed, getting up, getting off technology and doing any chores.
But I think that if you are not feeling in a great place yourself - then these things become enormously difficult.
Depressed people tend not to do the housework, for example....it is just too much. So our kids fight off doing anything as they just want to block it out. It could well have a discipline element - we are not as strong with them as we would be with a child without a mental health issue perhaps? But not sure what the answer is but it saddens me to hear how you feel about your son and him not getting better.

Have you been able to take the pressure off him in regard to getting to school? IS he getting any education at the moment? Is there any way of getting him involved in any skills that you or your wife have? Any friends who could step in for you...or family members? Is there a particular family member that he does relate to?
A friend of mine whose son has this is now 17 and doing well (although still fragile). The maturity seems to have kicked in and he is able to reflect on what his anxiety is and how to cope. He says he hates looking back on his life from 13-15 as it was such a dark time. So perhaps your son is stuck in the middle somewhere on the scale of improvement and with maturity he might be able to see that he does have to help himself to move forward and not totally rely on yourself and family. It is a long road - so don;t give up hope. Hang in there and show your son that you believe in him and what he will be able to do one day.
Take care
Linda xx

Re: what do we do now!

He is taking two on-line classes this summer because he failed to pass the 9th grade. The work is easy and he knows it isn't challenging enough to do him much good but he does manage to turn in 4 lessons per week. We take away his electronics until he completes the lessons.

He really enjoyed taking guitar lessons and was excelling at it too but quit just this past week, He can't face his guitar teacher. It was the only good think in his life the past year and now he quit that too.

HE is required to attend a single class once per week as part of his on-line summer classes but has yet to go. He will likely fail because of his non attendance.

Re: what do we do now!

Hi Terskac

You are in much the same situation as us - our son is 16 hasn't been to school for a year, didn't take any of his leaving exams and is not very co-operative with therapy sessions offered to him - so much so that I think the mental health team have washed their hands of him. My husband and I clash over how to treat him - I just tend to hope that as he matures he will begin to realise that the only person that can help him is himself. I spend a lot of time with him but I know my husband thinks I am too soft and that we should be pushing for more help from the "professionals". He is taking medication and we just try to get through each day. I am happy if I just see him smile!

He is just like your son in that he can't deal with face to face contact with anyone and it's funny but we bought him a guitar a couple of months ago and he is supposed to be teaching himself. He picked it up for a few days but it has now sat in the corner for weeks. He wants to do it but doesn't have the energy/enthusiasm to do it.

Our family life is now non-existent because we can't go out as a family and if my husband and I go out I am so conscious of getting back home to him.

I just wanted you to know that your son is not the only one feeling like this or acting like he is. Haven't got any answers but I know it helps to think you aren't alone with your struggles.

Sending lots of love and support x

Re: what do we do now!

Hi Kathy,

You sound like you need lots of love and support too : )

You mention that your son is on medication - and yet it is hard for him to just get through each day and he hasn't managed any education of any description? I am just wondering if the medication is working and whether you could go back to the doctor and try him on another kind? A friend of mine's son went through three different kinds of medication until they found one that lifted his mood enough to start to face life again. One medication also made him extremely tired.
I was very lucky that the first medication seemed to be working for my son...although I have no idea if some medication creates an even better mood and mind thought process than my son...but we are sticking with what works at the moment. THere was such a noticeable difference in my son once on medication. It took about 8 weeks to kick in properly and then perhaps some more before he realised that now that he felt better and put in some work himself that he could do so much more. Before this he had not wanted to leave the house.
You have probably tried everything but I would be checking out the medication just to be sure.

Does he have on-line friends that he can connect with? Is the technology taking over his life or is he just not motivated about anything much? It's so hard, isn't it, when we have not just a child with anxiety but a teenager and also the technology (although in our cases it is actually a link to the outside world for them when they close down).
I am sure there will be some small steps at some stage -
Take care
Linda

Re: what do we do now!

Hi Kathy

I have just read your post and really feel for you, it seems so like our situation and it is so difficult to know how to get any help with it when your child refuses all attempts to help them.

My son is 15 and hasn't been to school since January, he has spent most of that time in his room and has cut off all contact with friends and does not even use social media much. He had 1 session at CAMHs but refused to go back again, he has had 2 home tutor sessions but now refuses to do that. But I found it interesting that you say you bought him a guitar and he barely touches it now. My son has been selling a lot of his old things and made quite a bit of money on ebay which was good, but he has since been buying things that he says he really wants and then after a few days does not even look at them. We have a room full of weights in the basement, a large punch bag in the spare room, a new bike in the garage - all of which he seemed to lose interest in very quickly. It almost seems that he feels that if he gets the right thing it will make him feel better but in fact it just seems to make him more miserable when he realises that actually he doesn't feel any better.

I know just how you feel when you say you can't do anything as a family and I too feel so guilty if I go out and leave him but he just doesn't want to join in with anything.

I am sure he needs medication, but we can't get that unless he will go back to CAMHs and he refuses to do that. I don't think my GP can prescribe for him so we are in a catch 22. No help will come to him and he won't go out to get any help!

At least your son has agreed to medication and I do hope that this will start to kick in and things improve for you.

best wishes

Jill

Re: what do we do now!

Jill, I think it is ridiculous that your child can't get medication because therapy isn't successful. The idea that a teen that refuses therapy is the failure rather than the therapy turns logic on its head. It's a way to blame the child for the failure of the therapy.

The only thing that has helped my son at all is SSRI's. His first therapist warned us that sometimes that is the only thing that works with teenagers and I refused to believe it. I have since taken him to two other therapists and both of them tried but couldn't help.

He seems to be getting better now without any therapy. Just a new SSRI for the past month.
There are other things that are contributing to his better mood though. No school, one parent adjusting unrealistic demands, getting a friend to come to our house to get him to go out, meeting another teen with the same problem and planning a trip for next week with me to California. I'm taking him on a business trip with me.

Re: what do we do now!

Hi Terskac,

I get a sense of some relief from your posting. I do hope your son was able to go on the trip with you to California and in that found some freedom from his situation.
Interesting you also mention one parent needing to adjust. This seems to often be the case.

How did you find another teenager with the same problem? I would be interested to know and how the meeting went. My son has said he doesn't want to meet another teen we know who has had school refusal - but I think if they did meet - they would be somewhat relieved - but I am not sure in what situation I can actually get them to meet without them both feeling there are expectations of some kind.
A casual meeting is obviously something I am aiming for.

Hope all continues to move forward - even if slowly. You can find ways towards an education after your son regains his 'self' in this world.
Take care
Linda

Re: what do we do now!

Mark and Boo - how are things going? I am hoping there is something better in all of this for you recently as you have had a hard time of late.

And Kathy and Jill and everyone else - is it mid year summer break?


We have had two weeks holiday down here. I could say we just relaxed and had a good time and we kind of did but as we all do - I sit on edge as school approaches next week. I also am concerned because my son's sleeping habits turned upside down over the holidays and even after removing all technology - he still couldn't sleep - and then would sleep for half the day! I am sure it is the technology and anxiety that sends our kids off on strange sleeping patterns in the first place and perhaps it takes a lot more time than we have to help them re adjust.
HOpe everyone else is managing ok - and able to come on here if you are not.....always someone to listen and offer support. Non of you are alone : )
Take care
Linda

Re: what do we do now!

The trip to California went very well. There were a couple small episodes where he wanted to just stay in our hotel room but with some cajoling he managed to go along. He even completed three online lessons while we were there.
Getting him out of the house was good for him.
When we got home he was a little better than before. He refused to talk to the therapist and at first refused to go to the school for his private lesson but I talked him into it by promising him he only had to stay 5 minutes. He wound up staying about 20 minutes.

My advice is to try to stay calm no matter what. Even if the child is acting out or being violent. There is no use to having two or more people freaking out. Calm assurance works better for my son than stern discipline. He does not want to be treated like a small child. Eventually he usually complies with what we want. We have to learn to live with his limitations.

Re: what do we do now!

Hi friends, summer hols are here and for us it brings new challenges.

DD went to English and Science lessons in the last two weeks of term and registration most days. She also went into school for the form party for half an hour which she made a cake for. We were all pleased for her positive approach for this time of the school year that can be difficult. She has a very good support worker who comes to see the family for about an hour once a fortnight and DD is enjoying these sessions. She is from a community charity project that helps families with children who are having a variety of difficulties, she does some art therapy with DD and uses techniques from the Solihul parenting project to support my husband and me to set goals and find out what works well when tackling DD's difficulties.

School has linked us with the Education Outreach Service and have asked us to attend an assessment in conjunction with a CAMH's councilor that we are familiar with in a nearby town. This is great news but DD is still finding travelling to the location of these appointments very difficult. Even short trips to the shops or her nan's just down the road have been problematic recently. She has developed an irrational fear of car travel, she does not like more than 2 people in the car and certain roads she refuses to go down as they create such an uneasy feeling in her. It is a big challenge for both of us to just get in the car and take very short journeys. Her fears and worries are changing. Certain things have improved but others have got more acute.

We do not know what to do about DD getting access to these support services, how do we help her to reduce her anxiety when these appointments come up. I have to instigate every journey otherwise she would just stay at home all day where she feels safe and unworried by her anxiety. Then when we go on a journey there is often a battle or a point in the journey where she cannot go any further. We have been advised by Young Minds to ask for a new assessment of DD by an adolescent psychiatric doctor who should be part of the CAMH's team to reassess her.

The lack of family outings or just trips to the shops are creating a great strain on all the family and DD feels sad and guilty for the fact that we can't just go out for a picnic or to the zoo or a day trip to the seaside. I can't pick up a 12 year old and strap her into a car seat, she has to want to go and feel that she is going to be able to cope with what ever happens during the trip.

Any ideas, suggestions or advice are always gratefully received.
Hope all of you are hanging on in there, I count my blessings, every day and have to work really hard not to over think every aspect of things, enjoy the good moments and soak up all the love and support that friends and family offer. I know how many of you feel and my thoughts are with you.

Re: what do we do now!

Hi Mark and Boo

Sounds like there have been quite a few small steps taken - that is great. I know you will still be sitting on edge - as it is such a slow process, isn't it. We have to have more patience than seems humanly possible.

And as you know from my posts - things can roll along really well but there can be hiccups. The medication and maturity helped my son start to try and manage his own anxiety. And our psychiatrist reminded me of that last week - that my son will have anxiety all his life but if he can learn to manage it then he will be ok.
She feels he is definintely learning to manage it and always welcomes even the smallest of steps.
I can see you are doing that too. Your daughter will start to find ways she knows works. And then of course we have the hormones interfere with the whole process and throw it out of kilter - so its kind of a bit forward a bit backwards and forwards again for some time.
As I may have mentioned before - if things don't improve enough, however, then looking at medication to help kick start the process is something that might be worth trying.

Have you found that the person from the parenting programme understands where you are coming from with School Refusal and what you have to go through? You mention they use the Solihull techniques but do not come from that organisation? They sound very supportive -

For anyone who wants to know more about the Solihull approach/techniques - there is a website.
http://www.solihullapproachparenting.com/

I think we do need different parenting techniques than other parents and its always nice if someone can offer us some flexible, non judgemental ideas.
I don't have any great words of wisdom for you...but you are doing a great job. And I think Terskac's advice suggesting perhaps standing back when any anger and violence looks like happening is good advice too.
Has there been less or any outbursts lately?

Anyway - all the best and thanks for sharing where you are at now as I always wonder what is happening and how you are going. Its good to share with others what help you have managed to find as well.
Take care
Linda

Re: what do we do now!

Good to hear from you Linda. Just a quick note today, DD's behavior has improved and we are dealing with it differently standing back, and letting the firework go off then she comes to us and agrees that that her bahavior was unacceptable and almost suggests the consequences for her behaviour herself. V.positive step, her older brother is not getting involved in the DD behaviour as much and holds back in tryng to help my husband and I deal with DD and her issues.

The support worker from the charity project that use the Solihul parenting approach is understanding but objective, a positive force in our lives at the moment but we do not want to lose her support which we will do soon.
Off to filter the pool as it is so hot today, but will check in again soon to catch up.
Linda you are very giving and understanding, full of wise words and support thank you for that I hope I can return the support at some point but just keep doing what you are doing. I try living in the moment and not looking too far ahead i helps me manage the changes and issues we are dealing with at this moment in time and things can and do change and move on.

Take care all
x