Dear Keith,

My advice is purely on the practical side. There seems to be a lot going on here, but your concerns about about fines and prison need addressing.

I am sure that you know that as parents, we are legally responsible for making sure your child attends school regularly unless we are home-educating. We need to be able to demonstrate that we are doing our best to achive that.

Some schools/local authorities are tackling the problem by going to court - but others do seem to understand that this is often not the solution. However, there are some steps that you should be taking.

As a parent, we often do not recognise we have a problem til well into the situation. We do not, therefore take the steps we should be taking to ensure that we are properly prepared to deal with the school or local authority. So, as a first step, make a note of past meetings and telephone conversations that you have had with form teachers and senior school staff of both schools, with the health centre and with any other professionals that you have worked with. (I nearly wrote 'against'). Print off copies of paperwork, emails, etc, and collect them together into a folder that you can take with you to meetings.

Take a note of the content of all future meetings/conversations, etc. Ask who is writing the minute of the meeting and ensure that they copy you in. Where there is no minute, respond after the meeting with a note that lists the actions that they said they would do and that you and your son agreed to do.

Your son will be feeling that others are running his life and will be trying to assert his own set of controls. Getting him to say what he is going to do is an important part of this process. Most here on this forum will have experiencd their children promising to go in for one class a day (or whatever) and then failing to do so. But getting them to take some responsibility seems to be important. So he needs to be part of the negotiations that must take place.

You say that you have rung the school 3 times. You need written evidence of that, so an email is also required.

I hpe others on the forum will be able to support you in other ways. sadly, none of us has a magic wand. But we are a supportive lot. I know from personal experience.

Yours aye,

Simon

Dear Keith, Simon

I know what you're going through. It's hell. I can feel the anxiety bouncing off the screen at me.

I recently was able to attend a set of classes called 'take3 parenting' aimed at difficulty parenting teens. I didn't have any difficulty parenting until my daughter started school refusing. She's year 11 now, fairly literate but low verbal comprehension. She is on the point of being kicked out of a college course she's been allowed to do instead of school, and today has started refusing to attend openly.

It's such a nightmare.

The parenting course taught me so much. I'll try to give you a start- I work, I'm doing a PhD and I'm a single mum, so if I can somehow wriggle enough time to go on this course, so can you! It then boils down to priorities. So, some advice

1. Initially, don't tell your child you're looking for help. I think the first few weeks made such a difference, you might not need to explain it to them... it depends on your kid- do they tend to be also naughty- use things against you? If they're good for you but awful at school, then it's different, but mine is pretty awful at home a lot of the time.

2. Take a deep breath EVERY time you feel your shoulders tensing up- for us parents, that's every time we think of our school-refusing child. Breathe out for longer than you breathed in. Blow it out , if no-one's looking. It helps.

3. Try to REALLY listen to the WHOLE sentence your annoying/ moronic/ vile/ lost/ unhappy/ unconfident kid is saying to you. REALLY listen.

4. Think about what they told you.

5. Imagine what it really feels like to be them- it doesn't matter that you felt the same and you got through it, because they are not you, and they're not getting through it.

6. Ask them what they want and listen to the answer.

7. Make sure you say that you're pleased, that it has made a difference to you, and that you appreciate them trying EVERY single time they even get out of bed/ put the dishes away when asked (or later on after you've asked them twenty times)/ got dressed in the morning/ spoken politely for a few sentences.... etc. EVERY SINGLE THING they do, that you WANT them to do, NOTICE it.

8. Take time to enjoy yourself- and make sure they know you are doing this, and why: it's a reward, you're treating yourself for ... whatever you've achieved, even if that is 'not raising your voice that day'.

9. Tell them clearly what you want from them, FOR them (not the things you want for you, hehe.. that's a stretch).

10. Get help from your GP- get them into PCAMHS and stay calm. If they're alive, that's a massive massive plus, you've succeeded where hundreds of parents haven't. REMEMBER THAT.

11. Stick up for your kid, in a practical way. Yes, they should follow all the rules of society, blah blah. They have to know that you agree to that. You are trying to help them to do that, trying to support them in doing that. You're doing your best.

12. Make sure the child IS aware that the consequences for you are possibly prison, but be calm about that, and make arrangements that they understand about what will happen to the rest of the family, if you're a single parent. Do this calmly, and practically, and keep on telling your child that you love them, and will love them whatever happens.

It will get better, because inevitably, they will eventually not have to go to school, which means it will be better for you, even if they've lost a few years education. I made it to uni when I was 30. They might too. Make sure they do know that.

Above all, try to make them laugh, because that's the glue that holds you together and it's like medicine. Yes they're appalling. Yes, the teachers are like maniacs blethering on about rules etc. Yes, they are screwing up their life and yours. Do you wish you hadn't had them, and do you think you'll always feel that way? Keep on remembering the feeling you had when you were a new parent- all that love; practice feeling that, and make sure they know it. These kids for some reason are just awkward, different, fragile or bold. They're still kids, a bit lost.

I would also advice keeping track of good stuff that happens and writing it down somewhere. I can remember back in August when for the first time in a year, my daughter actually said thank-you to me, for something. Doesn't sound like a lot does it? A year of being sworn at, attacked, threatened with suicide etc... this one 'thank-you' was such a high point it made me cry. You'll have these high points of your own: that is the real person in your child. While they're struggling with their teenage brain, they're pretty much insane and you can only guide them by pointing out when they've done something RIGHT, because they already know every time they've done something WRONG, which for them, is most of the time. How would that make you feel? Well, you're a good parent, each of you, because you already looked for help, by posting here... that means you are the small percentage of parents who don't think they're ALWAYS doing it right, and don't need to learn anything.

Deep breath... I can here the door key turning, as my daughter who went missing today seems to be home: time to paste on a smile of welcome and calmly tell her that she's done the right thing by returning...
good luck guys!

Ruth

Your post rang so true. And you reminded me to remind myself to remember the positives. I also have written down the good things and refer to this from time to time. I also try to remember when my son does something positive. It can be so draining, however, just that constant kind of 'waiting' for an improvement. Waiting for them to get out of bed....waiting for them to do any school work....waiting....waiting .....waiting!!

And sometimes we get so bogged down in the here and now we forget to reflect. And if I reflect back....my son has grown, matured and his over thinking has meant he is really good at philosophy!! So there are positives out of the years of negatives.....and yes - we must just keep hanging in there as we do - and take those deep breaths. Good advice. Take care - hope things improve for you soon.

And also for you Keith....I think Simon's advice is very wise. I also would find out more about what is happening when at school. Sometimes there can actually be a learning problem that results in behaviour that is not the norm or acceptable. It covers the real problem. You are doing what you can....and it takes time...lots of small steps. Take those deep breaths like Ruth suggests and write down the positives, no matter how small or apparently insignificant.
Hope things improve soon....but you also find some strength for yourself in all this.
take care
Linda

thank you everyone for your replies they made me feel a little better knowing im not on my own and there are plenty of people out there to offer advise and help.
I have spoken with my son and social workers and come to the conclusion that moving him to another school may help. so I have put in for a transfer and now are just waiting on the councils response. hopefully I will hear early in the new year.
The problem I have at the minute is apart from his dubious friends is that his sleep pattern is all over the place I try to get him up as early as I can but for some reason he wants to stay up all night and sleep all day. he is currently still asleep at 330 in the afternoon !
Im hopefull for the future and hope as he gets older he will become more aware of other peoples feelings

Hi Keith

Thanks for posting an update. Sorry to hear things are still not so good but the new school might be ok. You mentioned previously that he was sent to another school? Will this be different?

Is your son using computer or iPad etc at night? Screen usage makes it difficult for the brain to switch off and I understand it changes their 'circadian' rhythms and this is not easy to fix.

The iPad especially is addictive as my sons reactions when I limit its usage is just like an addict. As there are so many other issues going onl then it's a hard one to tackle so if it is happening to you too, then I'm sorry I have no answer. the more depressed my son was, however, the more he slept in. And yes...have had the still asleep at 3.30 scenario....it's awful for us to witness, isn't it. And we feel so helpless and have no control. Nothing we do or say has any impact. All I can say is that the getting up has improved since my son's mood has improved and school for us has also finished for the year. So your son might be depressed? it is most likely he is as he.is probably frustrated and somewhat confused if his behaviour has resulted in where he is now.

Hang in there and interested to hears how a new school goes. Depending on what the underlying issue is, a new school can be the change they need or it can just bring out the same symptoms.
What was the behaviour issues that caused the teachers to ring so often and why did yiu have to pick him up?

Linda

Hi Keith

Just wondering how things are going and if you decided to put in for the school transfer or not.
Hope things are ok - let us know how you get on with the changes that were planned.
Linda

hi all
just an update
my son has been excluded from 1 school and had managed move break down from another.
we put in for a school transfer and have just been told that our first choice has been turned down. lets hope we fair better with our second choice (9 miles away)
then the hard work starts to get him there
will update again when I have more to tell

All the best Keith. Thanks for the update. Small steps are all good. And make sure you take some time out for yourself on the journey.
Linda

hi

just an update the council have told us that our 3 nearest schools have refused to take our son and that he will have to return to the school he is refusing to go to.
I just don't know what to do ?
I don't want to be prosecuted
maybe have to home school to avoid that
any advise ?

Hi Keith

I'm sorry to hear about th situation you are in. What reasons have they given for not taking your son? Have you been the one asking the schools or has the original school been doing this on your behalf? It might be time to lobby one of them....or if you can, home school. As long as it is recognised that you are doing all you can to find these options for your son and push for th schools, then I doubt you would be prosecuted.
What does the original school suggest?

In many ways you are going to have to go with your gut feeling on this. If you feel that trying further for schools is not going to work then see what you can find out from home schooling in your local area; is there a support group, an on line group etc.
there is some information in the resource section of this website.

Meanwhile I would also be making sure that The schools who have refused have a sound reason for doing so and if not, pursuing that further. Do you think your local MP might be interested in your story and finding support or pursing the schools on your behalf?Just an idea as sometimes it needs someone with a bit more authority to get the ball rolling in the right direction. Or medical or psychological support?

Hang in there....something will turn up and the road will move forward again. Is your son getting any help? His self esteem is probably pretty low at this point too? Keep trying to boost his self confidence in any way you can, kids show different ways of not coping but you know your son best and what he might be going through. Is he still staying up late and sneaking out? it might be a phase but a worrying one non the less. Are you able to embrace him where he is now or are you still at the 'I wish he was like other kids' stage? I know that my shift to acceptance that my son was not the same as other kids was a big step forward for both of us. It is very hard as we just want everything to run smoothly and normally.

I don't recall if you mentioned if your son had been tested for any learning problem? Just wondering if his behaviour, re not being able to be handled by the school, is some indication of this? Sometimes it can go undetected because everyone is focusing on the behaviour.
It may not have been as noticeable at primary school. Or has this coincided with a family situation or both? I am sure you have been down this track with the social workers but sometimes some avenues are missed in the process, I know from my own experience. And schools are the worst place for a child to be dealing with emotional and/or learning difficulties, as you know.
Take care and keep us informed of how things are going and always remember you are not alone.
Linda

hi
feeling very low today as ive just had the original schools attendance offcer on the phone saying what have I decided to do ? either bring him to school or deregister him and being very aggressive and not offering any help just those 2 options.
I have appealed against the 3 schools that have turned him down as they all have spaces so shouldn't be able to say no. hopefully we will find out soon. the sooner the better. I have told the attendance officer this and cant she wait until the outcome before I make a decision. she just says he has t come to school I have asked HOW she just says its your parental responsibility.
its really getting me down as I don't have the money if I get fined
I will deregister him if it means avoiding that but think I will find it very difficult to home school
we now have an intence parenting people comng round 3 times a week for hours to help us hopefully they will help us.
my son was referred to be checked for mental illness but was declined as he didn't meet all the critera
I wish the original school would explell him then at least the council would give us another school but they seem to not want to do that. I think I would have a beeter chance of him going to anther school

sorry for the spelling mistakes I fell off my motorbike and have broken my elbow
it never rains but pours

Gosh Keith, you are in the wars!
The school attendence officer has no right to get so annoyed. I suspect they have to tick the boxes to show they have done their job.
If you cannot get your child to school, the school legally has to provide assistance by providing work or tutors or support to another school. Your school does not seem to be doing all they can.
Make sure you document all these discussions and phone calls you have so that you can show, if needed, that they are not providing support.
u
It sounds to me like your sin has not been assessed properly and is being treated only as having a behavior issue. I can't recall if you have any support from a doctor? Your son needs support. Does your son still stay in touch with any friends? Can you try and ensur he stays engaged with something outsice the home, so that if he does need to transition to a new school, he will be more prepared? Have you found any of the resources on this school refusal site helpful?

Hang in there. Something will turn up, but in the meantime, see what help yiu can get for your son and yourself.
Linda

hi just a small update
my son has friends that he goes out to see and he has friends over to the house even though only 1 of them go to school and they are a bit older than him maybe 15/16 he is 14 next month
I have spoken to him about going to the doctor but he refuses to go. I have been on my own and the doc says he cant do anything until my son goes.
he has been sneaking out after we have gone to bed at night but recently not as much
I recived a phone call to see if I was going to attend the appeal for a alternate school place next week this was the 1st I knew of this. the council should have given written notice of at least 2 weeks ! I have moved this to the next week now to allow me to get a letter from my social worker saying he doeasnt want him going to the orginal school
fingers crossed we will win our appeal and he feels more confident to go to the new and closer school
thanks for your replies it helps a lot to know im not the only pareant going though this nightmare
I hope everyones problems get resolved very soon

hi
just wanted to update everyone and show that there is light at the end of a very long tunnel but this proves sometimes we can get our child back to school.
after a total of 6 months of my son who is now 14 refusing to go to school and with the help of many social workers and a pycholigist and an appeal for anlternative school and many frustrating weeks/days hours of my wife and me at the end of our tether. my son returned to a different school than the original school last Tuesday after the easter school holidays. today he will have been for 2 weeks and fingers crossed he will continue going with no problems.

The school are trying to advise us to take him out of school in September and go to a reginal college which we are not keen on as it is over 8 miles away.

he seems a lot happier and as he has to be up for school at 6am this means he hasn't had the energy to go out all night with his friends so hopefully killed 2 birds with 1 stone.

The school have him in the behavioural unit from 0730 until 1230 but im hoping that they will try him in some lessons when its seen he is doing well and is not in trouble.

Thanks to everyone in this forum I was very sad and depressed about all this and have come close to ending it all as I was struggling to hold down a full time job with all this stress. You have all been a great help and made me feel I wasn't alone and I wasn't a failure as a parent
Some children just need a bit of extra help to guide them

Remember if you had 5 children none would be the same
Don't worry about other parents saying look at my children they are so great getting awards and certificates as those parents are in the minority. most pareants just have normal children that need us as parents a little more

Thank you, Keith, for this encouraging update.

It can be a long haul though some very dark tunnels, but we just have to keep going.

Simon

Hi Keith

That is great news! You must be so relieved to have broken through the barrier and startd to have success. I can't imagine my son ever getting up at 6am! I hope the success continues and remember, all steps, no matter how small, are all good.
You have certainly had your fair share of stress. You have some words of wisdom for all of us, so you have obviously been finding ways to manage despite the negatives you faced.
Make sure you do keep up your strength and don't put off the idea that you may need your own counselling and even anti depressants. I have taken anti depressants to help me through and am glad I have.

Thinking of you and hoping you can spend some time on you now and get some normality back imto your life. Even if ther are further hiccups, remember you have both come a long way amd can alway move ahead again.
All the best
Linda