When did it become a sin to brag on your wins on this forum, when did it become 'bad' to congratulate someone you know who won. My gosh we all go through the heartbreak of trying to breed good dogs that can win at a dog show, or do well at a hunt test or in agility, or produce a search and rescue dog, or a therapy dog,etc. Then we are not allowed to be proud of the fact that we actually were successful or one of our friends or just an acquaintance did well. Why is it everyone admires a winner in other sports but in this sport so many hate the winners. I really don't understand this. This is such a hard hobby with so much heartbreak, why are we not allowed to celebrate our hardwon victories. Do we want everyone to just struggle for success but never attain it?? I don't think that any breeder or just dog owner should have to apologize for actually meeting their goals once they have attained them. You know in other sports a lot of money is made when one is successful. That is really not the case in this sport, so our victories are really all we have and I for one think we should all get to celebrate them.
Judy

Amen Judy! Seems that when your dogs don't win everyone is your friend in this sport, as soon as your dogs win a lot then you are the enemy and everyone is out to get you :{
Aloha,
Jackie

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Replying to:

When did it become a sin to brag on your wins on this forum, when did it become 'bad' to congratulate someone you know who won. My gosh we all go through the heartbreak of trying to breed good dogs that can win at a dog show, or do well at a hunt test or in agility, or produce a search and rescue dog, or a therapy dog,etc. Then we are not allowed to be proud of the fact that we actually were successful or one of our friends or just an acquaintance did well. Why is it everyone admires a winner in other sports but in this sport so many hate the winners. I really don't understand this. This is such a hard hobby with so much heartbreak, why are we not allowed to celebrate our hardwon victories. Do we want everyone to just struggle for success but never attain it?? I don't think that any breeder or just dog owner should have to apologize for actually meeting their goals once they have attained them. You know in other sports a lot of money is made when one is successful. That is really not the case in this sport, so our victories are really all we have and I for one think we should all get to celebrate them.
Judy

Judy,
I dont get it. Did I miss something? Where is this coming from?
Or do you just have a personal experience? It is just a kinda "out of the blue" type of thing.

I am also confused. What the rank on a relatively quiet forum now?

It isn't a sin to congratulate the winners, it however possibly a sin not to CONGRATULATE the winners when not your dogs! Seems a little one sided is all I think.

Best of luck to everyone and congratulations to ALL the Potomac winners!

Yes, have to agree with this one!!
That is for sure, and there are breeders who are know for doing it.

What is this about, did I miss something also. The Potomac seem quiter this year. We have not heard much. Think the wind and cold put a damper on some things. New dogs won, meaning some we had not been familier with. Judges are all different in what they like. But the best of breed ring must have been beautiful with all our favorites and the veterans. Congrats again to winners.

Judy,

I had the great pleasure to meet you and the other members of the HYSPIRE TRIFECTA. It was a sincere pleasure and a treat to be in their space. Logical, respectful, intelligent albeit a bit crazy for driving 9000 miles for a show, but that is another story


I really feel sorry for the posters/breeders who sit home alone hunched over bitterly hammering out hateful vomit to make themselves feel better on this forum. Somehow chopping off the heads of successful people make themselves feel taller. HOW SAD,

Haven been the target of their ire, I too was upset, no more, I sincerely feel a sense of sorrow. They will always be miserable mediocre and morbid.

BRAG AWAY!! Remember, if you do not toot your own horn, someone else is going to use it as a spittoon.

CHEERS

I think what some of the posters are saying is they dont like others wins shoved in their face.
Or will you say boasting? No one is saying not to be proud. But maybe do it with a little cooth and class?
I think that is the point, nothing more nothing less.

I don't brag for any of my friends anymore last time I did it I got yelled at and told I should not post other's brags and it was inconsiderate to them not to allow them to post their own...sigh...I was just happy for them...now I don't even post my own.

I am responding to the post from:"a point to be made"
Do you feel that anyone who posts on this forum is shoving that post in your face? Those were your exact words "shoved in your face". People who post brags are just posting, they are not shoving anything. You are not required to read all posts, be selective. If someone else's happiness is so offensive, be selective, don't read the brags. You have all the control over your mouse.

A really good dog speaks for him/her self...No bragging is necessary!

Judy Heim says:

Why is it everyone admires a winner in other sports but in this sport so many hate the winners.
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I've been banging my head away at this sport for a long time...spent a lot of money...cried a lot of tears.

It's very disturbing to see so many hateful people in one arena.

When I was at the Potomac I was introduced to a 'lady' whom I had been wanting excitedly to meet and the first words out of her mouth after "hello" were "ok guys now who can we gossip about and what dogs look like shit".

They all proceeded to sit down and rip people and dogs apart. I quickly removed myself from the situation.

Needless to say I was taken aback and thought to myself "this is not someone I want to know at all and any one that hangs with her either" I also felt sad to think this was someone I admired and had respected what they had done in the breed...they had no depth of character or empathy for other people.

I don't see things’ changing in Labs any time soon and that alone is discouraging.

I just focus on my dogs and the few close friends I do have and no longer look to Labs to find friends or approval.

The people in this sport are nothing more than acquaintances for the most part.

I've too have been hurt by others, been taken advantage of, lied to and about, had business deals go bad and lost lots of money.

People you would never suspect have taken advantage of me when I was new...they should be ashamed but they don't have enough conscious or character to have those feelings.

We're in a sad state of affairs in Labs and I don't think these forums are a positive thing anymore.

Just my honest feelings, experiences and point of view.

you wrote - "BRAG AWAY!! Remember, if you do not toot your own horn, someone else is going to use it as a spittoon."
hee hee it's a good one, we must remember that. time to print it out and put it over my desk! Jane P

I know exactly what you mean. It seems that some of these "Lab folks" only claim to fame are their dogs, and it goes straight to their head. I have another concern. What about these well known handlers and the dogs they show. Recently, there have been two sets of husband and wife handlers showing a known puppy broker (from western NY) dogs. Do these handlers not care who they take in the ring as long as they're paid their fee? Nothing against the dogs, it's certainly not their fault and they may very well be worthy of a win, but this woman should be stopped, not promoted. It makes me rethink what I'm doing in this hobby, that's for sure.

AGREED!!!!
Cheers.

the lady doth protest too much, methinks.

it is a nice quiet saturday, and people answering questions about this and that, then someone who needs attention comes on and causes a fuss about how maligned they feel, when no maligning comments were ever made. sigh!

"Observer" we know who you are and something I said must have hit a nerve. Leave it for once..can you do that?

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the lady doth protest too much, methinks.

it is a nice quiet saturday, and people answering questions about this and that, then someone who needs attention comes on and causes a fuss about how maligned they feel, when no maligning comments were ever made. sigh!

I agree ...but it's lots of fun when you are so thrilled about a win that you or a friend worked so hard for.

Some people do cross the line with their constant pictures and never ending brags but we all know who they are and typically they only brag so much about themselves because they are not real achievers …..so who really cares!

So, should the new rule be: never post a win or brag? Let the dog do the talking?

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A really good dog speaks for him/her self...No bragging is necessary!

Judy, to put a smile on your face read the Potomac Knut and Hagas poetry, it might help lighten and brighten your day. http://pub12.bravenet.com/forum/976632990/show/631579

Potomac was wonderful, you 3 Hyspire women have beautiful dogs and if people don't think so that's their problem. You 3 know what you have, isn't that all that counts? Don't fret over a few people that don't appreciate the beauty of well bred and cared for winning dogs. Brag all you want, I didn't see you do it but no one is stopping you

You'll never get it, how can we understand the insanity of jealousy?

I know who you are talking about and I agree, that really set me back. Hate to talk about it, but that is how the person is thought of by most. Was surprised.

"Recently, there have been two sets of husband and wife handlers showing a known puppy broker (from western NY)"

Don't you mean in PA??

"Recently, there have been two sets of husband and wife handlers showing a known puppy broker (from western NY)"
Don't you mean in PA??>>

Nope.

Guess I am out of the loop. Were these dogs at Potomac?

>>Guess I am out of the loop. Were these dogs at Potomac?>>

Yes.

Guess I'd better look around by the light of the moon eh?

Guess so. Let's hope these handlers "take a look around" too.

It probably isn't the first wrong turn they have taken. Yep it is all about the bucks. Pretty sad.

Also central Northren Pa. Pro. Handlers handling Brokers dogs and pups at the POTOMAC!!!! Saw them on the resylts was not there but I do know the breeders and also the handlers Shame!!!!!

I for one am sick of breeders who think they are better than others. Why? It is uncalled for.

Yep, it's all about money and as soon as you're onto them, you're the bad guy or better yet, the "breeders who think they are better than others." I guess they need some excuse no matter how lame.

I may be wrong and some may feel I have fliped but this is my take. I think people from the from the east coast in general are much more conservative while people from the west are a lot more liberal. I think east coasters are more old school and do not feel the need to TOOT, the proof is in the pudding they might say. Is that wrong, NO it's the way they think so what? as far as west coasters in general old school is out the window so what? two differnt trains of thought on two different track that will probably not be meeting any time soon!! so what life goes on.

All I know is, if the rest of us who seem to be able to play nice stick together, eventually the crotchity one's will die off!!!!

Let's make it a new world people...suck it up!! old dogs CAN new learn tricks.


I can't believe some would think there can ever be TOO much congratulations.

I don't care if your 5 yrs. old playing your first TBAll game, 26 and having a new baby,,,or any age winning a class with your dog. Everyone likes a little acknowledgement now and again. It's a feel good thing. If you don't...your lying

I did not just pull this out of my hat to cause trouble. I did see it on a post and yes it happened a few days ago. I have been out of town for a while and was trying to catch up a bit on the forum. Someone had congratulated someone else and of course another poster had to jump on there and criticize. I can absolutely guarantee you if I got on there and bragged on any win we had, there would absolutely be criticism. And again I do not understand that way of thinking in this sport. YOu say let the dogs speak for themselves and I say then why are there any ads in the Quarterly or in the catalogs or any other Labrador publications if we are "letting the dogs speak for themselves". If you think that I am just speaking of our own wins I am not. (Quite frankly we never post our wins on here anymore and seldom does anyone else congratulate us or mention our wins either.) I have seen this happen quite often on this forum to others. I personally love to see results or congratulations listed on this forum as then I know whose dogs are doing what. Its something that interests me because this is my hobby. Just like if I loved football I would be reading the paper and watching t.v. to see how the teams were doing, and you can darned well bet if I owned one of the teams and it was winning I would be proud to tell everyone how well my team was doing. But can I do this when my dogs win somewhere - no I cannot because someone might get mad and say I was bragging.
And do not say I don't congratulate other people when they win with a dog that I have nothing to do with. You have no idea who I congratulate unless you follow me around to every dog show and come home with me and read over my shoulder to see what emails I am sending or read my mail to see what congratulatory cards I am mailing out. There are many times when someone's win is listed on the forum and I do not congratulate them on the forum but send them a private, more personal congratulations. I also often respond privately to a tradgedy that someone has posted rather than respond on the forum. So when you are saying that people out there are not congratulating others- well I don't know how you could possibly know that. Do I ever miss congratulating someone- of course I do. That means I am human and just miss it sometimes, not that I am upset that they won or even ignoring that they won.
I know this post sounds like I am angry but if I was talking instead of typing and you could hear the tone of my voice you would know I am not. I just think our ideas are a bit skewed on this whole "don't let anybody know your dog won anything" game we seem to play on this forum. Let me tell you when you have a dog that is winning a lot and you too have to hang your head in shame because you are actually doing well- you will also recognize the irony in it. I am sure many of you are already in that position or will be in the near future if the quality of the dogs I have seen this year at the specialties is any indication of how good most of the Labradors are right now! I forsee a lot of people having some great wins in the future. I hope you get to rejoice in those wins.
Judy

In my world (dressage) everything is based on a score of 10, which is rarely achieved. You ride into the ring and do individual movements that are scored by the judge on this base. You scores are totalled and you get your test back with the judges comments on each movement at the end of the class. It is important to keep in mind that your overall score in each test should be steadily improving as you go to another show. It is easier than dog shows in a way - less subjective even though the judge should be looking at the standard. So I leave the arena and know deep within my heart - I did better on this movement or that or overall than last time. And if someone has a disasterous ride, I always find something nice to say to them about their ride and give them a hug - because there IS something nice to say about it. Maybe they had a lovely halt and salute. And I always congratulate the winner. It usually is a well deserved win. The goal is to steadily improve. That is not to say I do not ride into the arena to win - I do. I know that I am never satisfied with less than perfection - but in the real world there is always a better, more expensive horse and that is just the ways it is. Your goal is to maximize what you have. I have won classes doing a very smooth flawless ride on a less-than horse. Same for dogs - there is always a better dog, handled by someone who is more knowledgeable and smoother -so I try and learn from them. Why all the sour grapes? Learn, learn learn. That is what life is all about - too short to be grumpy.
A

Judy wrote: "I forsee a lot of people having some great wins in the future. I hope you get to rejoice in those wins."

Judy I hope that normal people with balanced lives don't give in to the nasty, smallminded, hate mongers that jump onto these lists and spew their angry bile. Please brag away for yourselves and others, it is a way we learn what is winning, who is putting up what, and who is producing what. We should be focused on those breeders and Labrador supporters amoung us that are moving the breed forward; and not spending so much time acknowleging and placating the mean spirited amoung us. Their goal is not to move forward; but instead, to hold everyone else back to their level of mediocrity. Pooh on them and let's keep them in perspective, call them out for the crackpots they are, and move forward.

When I was at the Potomac I was introduced to a 'lady' whom I had been wanting excitedly to meet and the first words out of her mouth after "hello" were "ok guys now who can we gossip about and what dogs look like shit".
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WOW this blows my mind. I cannot understand why someone would make the trip to such an amazing show and want to pick apart dogs in such a criticizing way. I always feel like a kid on 4th of July. Oohing and ahhhing over them all...
Some people are just not happy unless they can poo-poo on someones parade.

I am new to this forum and sport. I appreciate very much when someone posts about a win. I can then go look that kennel up and appreciate their dogs and learn learn learn.
So please don't stop congratulating each other. Someday, MAYBE! with a lot of time, hard work and a little luck, it will be me.

And anyone who says they dont like a pat on the back for a job well done, is NOT being honest. Sincere appreciation from our respected peers is the greatest reward.

Maybe someone posted as they have had a personal experience? You know you always hear this and that ringside. But, if someone has had the experience of unsportmanlike behavior, maybe they would write in.
Just a thought

Judy

I try to congratulate people on another board as we go on a first name basis there. We share more about our lives and dogs then is done here.

Just because someone doesn't publicly congratulate another or doesn't have the time to email a breeder ( I don't necessarily mean you) it doesn't mean they aren't happy for you.

I enjoyed the stacked and other photo's as well as the chance to meet three of Slim's get at Potomac. It was a thrill rooming with one of them for four nights and seeing the other two, one in their home environment in NY state, the third at Potomac.

That gave me more pleasure than I can express and only wish you the best with all of your dogs. You three ladies are a class act with some of the finest studs in the US (I am not tush kissing, I am saying what I feel) I hope to have the chance to breed to one of your boys down the road IF you'll accept one of my girls.

Please realize the unsaid is not always bad. I'm honestly not very comfortable on this board anymore due to all of the arguing. I tend to stick to another one and hope at some point you decide to come over there as more than a reader. Many would benefit from your expertise and you might find more warmth there as I have.

Wishing you the best with all of your boy and girls, your recent move to Oregon and please don't let this get to you. Watching all this keeps me from putting my best girl out there for fear of just what many of you go through. If you do well you can be ostrosized (sp) and if you don't the same can happen.

I'm being bluntly honest and publicly, if someone doesn't like what I'm saying oh well. I've never been known not to speak my mind.

Good luck, best wishes and much succss for the Hyspire Ladies and their dogs.

Best regards

Michelle

"oy.vey@verizon.net
Message: Judy"

" try to congratulate people on another board as we go on a first name basis there. We share more about our lives and dogs then is done here."

Oy Vey ( and everyone else)
I actually have been giving serious thought to switching to another forum where posters must be registered. There are many people who post on this forum that I enjoy but I just don't see any reason to continue to deal with those few that say such mean and often untrue things just because they can hide behind their anonymity. I love all the things that Jill has done on this site but life throws you enough negative things without going out looking for them by reading a forum where folks can be anonymous and vicious. Its not that I can't take those slings and arrows- just don't chose to. I think I prefer to accentuate the postive and stick with those who prefer to live their lives seeing the glass half full. Now did I throw enough cliche's in that post- if not I am sure I could throw in a few more...a stitch in time...., a penny save... and so on. See you guys at the next specialty and looking forward to it..
Judy

top breeders don't have to go on forums and toot there wins, look at the other top breeders do they do it??? i think not. if i had the success of hyspire or any other top kennel i wouldn't waist time argueing about this same topic all the time. come on aren't you in this long enough to know better judy???

"Just a thought"

With a comment like that after all that has been said it proves why many have stayed away from here, a place where many can learn and assist each other. There are times I take a look-see once a week at best missing sometimes the good and the bad.

Your comment was cruel, nasty and there was no reason for it at all. Plain old jealousy IMO

Im out of here (as it brings the worst out in me) for now to spend some quality time with people I enjoy. I don't have the time, patience or inclination for this childish nonsense.

"I also often respond privately to a tradgedy that someone has posted rather than respond on the forum"

Judy, I for one can vouch for that with my trials with my girl and truly thank you for your kindness and sincere caring, (and we have never even met - which makes it all the more special).

I agree with Oyvey. There is another forum out there full of caring, classy people who better deserve your caring, contribution to the breed and who truly and sincerely appreciate all you have done and have accomplished/deserved in the ring.

Not that I am anywhere near seasoned in the dog show world, far from it. It is people like you that keep the "bug" going in me to want to show my dogs.

However, its the negative posters here that make me want to stay away from it.

I'm very torn at this point in my life and my dogs.

Too much negativity. My God.......!!!!! We should all be proud of our dogs and what we have produced and if it means saying "look what my baby did in the ring today"! So be it. You Go Girl! And anyone else that has done well in the ring with their dogs!

Shame on those that are opposed to this. These women have worked hard to be where they are today.

And don't anyone tell me that I am not involved enough in showing "dogs" to voice my opinion. You're too late..... because I just did

top breeders don't have to go on forums and toot there wins, look at the other top breeders do they do it??? i think not. if i had the success of hyspire or any other top kennel i wouldn't waist time argueing about this same topic all the time. come on aren't you in this long enough to know better judy???

THAT'S the stupidest damn thing I've ever heard in my life. I hope someone figures you out, no good luck, congratulations or slaps on your back for you!!!

Hell, how boring, I go nuts just getting first in my class...bell whistles and cocktails for everyone!!!

It's called good sportsmanship!! I've seen 8 year old 4H KIDS with more than some of you! Shame!!

I'll be posting every win I get from here on out. I'm a kind of IN your face person. You can congratulate me or look away. WOW!! you have a choice.

Now whos being mean, nasty and cruel? Sounds like a hypocrit to me.

I am a hypocrite??? Are you referring to me? I'm not sure I saw anyone being hypocritical,,seems pretty cut and dry..you either are a happy person who can congratulate others or you aren't.

""""top breeders don't have to go on forums and toot there wins, look at the other top breeders do they do it???""""""


oooohhhh so not true! In my area the English Mastiff people are always in a group and partying like there is no tomorrow. The whole crowd is talking together, standing around with their dogs.
I rented a stall one year at specefic show grounds, they are always partying at the All breed shows. Right outside they had a HUGE get together, raffled a bunch of crap, not a specialty in site. Also have a top breeder(mastiff) in my area...she has a forum on her website, much like this one. There are more brags and salutes on that site than I have ever seen!!

All I know, is after spending the morning showing my labs, and two out of the 30 entries there even smiled or said hi, or get out of the way, or anything, I laughed outloud when my friend said,,,"maybe you should get into mastiffs? they're a friendly group!"

My friend now has aquired 3 mastiffs over those 3 years

Judy, you forgot this one -

"I'm all for people getting ahead, as long as it's not ahead of me."

I used to read here a lot because I wanted to learn. I don't look here much any more. Too much nastiness. I agree with the person who questioned the value of forums. I am more and more.

Golden rule, golden rule, golden rule etc....
I like the info on this site...
Thanks everyone for being so helpful and congratulations to everyone who EVER won anything.
Golden rule, golden rule, golden rule!
A