Can you guys give me your opinions on them? Do you promote them? My lab pulls badly and HATES the head collars, both the gentle leader and the halter collar and I don't have the strength to use a choke chain (old shoulder injury, plus he just chokes on it anyway. I was at an all breed show as a spectator and someone told me that they don't allow them on AKC show grounds. Is that true? I borrowed a premium list and I didn't see any rule against it. Just some input please and thank you!

If your dog "HATES" the head collar , [ Halti , gentle leader} I would say that is exactly the collar you should be using. Especially on a dog that pulls , and does not respect you. If your dog does not like it , it is because he is NO LONGER IN CONTROL , which is exactly what you want. It is meant to be a TOOL that will correct a specific problem , then not used on a permanent basis. Take a class before using it, YOU need to know how to do it properly, so that neither of you are injured.

Prong collars are not allowed on show grounds. I used one on my first lab years ago (before halti's were readily available). I used the prong for about a month - my instructor showed me how to fit it and use it properly - and after a month I switched back to the buckle collar. He 'got' it very quickly and quit pulling.

Your are exactly right, the dog that hates those collars is the one that needs it the most.

I have a good friend who is a vet and specializes in canine behavior. She uses and recommends the Gentle Leader. I have been able to lead as many as 6 Labs through a busy show site with no one pulling on me.

You do need to know how to use it properly, though. Many times you need to do the opposite of your normal tendency. For instance, when you want the dog to move forward you don't pull forward on the leash. The way the Gentle Leader works it would be telling the dog to stop.

Once a dog gets used to these type collars, they can actually give a shy dog confidence and calm a nervous dog.

Mike

...not the premium list.
Prong collars, electric collars, etc are not allowed on any show grounds, period.
The use of prong collars has increased in the pet owning population because they are either going to the wrong type of "trainer" or want a quick fix to a behavior modifying situation.

I have been doing obedience for a very long time. THIS IS JUST MY OPINION. The prong collars seem to be much more humane on the dog than a choke used out of control or even a halti. The choke can actually cause esophaugus problems as well as spine. The halti controls just the head, sometimes the neck gets injuries if used incorrectly. If you put the prong collar around your wrist and pull you will see it is an even pressure all around, and definately looks worse than it feels. I agree with the other lister that after you have used this to control your dog you can wean them to a different collar. Please make sure you know how to use this collar, and no they aren't allowed on AKC grounds. It is best to leave your dog home at shows, they usually don't encourage non-entered dogs to be there.

This is to New here.First poster Could you put your email address down or email me. I would love to help you on this. Diane

I know that the prong collars are not allowed on AKC grounds, but isn't it the same for the Gentle Leaders and Haltis, as well? I was told (by an AKC rep) that GL's and Haltis are not permitted by AKC, because they are considered 'training' tools. Has this rule changed?

I pointed out to a specatator at a recent specialty that the prong collar they had on their dog wasn't allowed. This dog was unruly and had growled at some other dogs and shouldn't have been there in the first place. The owners got PO'd at me and said they were friends of the show chair. Talked to her and she was PO'd that I said anything to them! Unbelievable that a specialty show chair would think her friends were exempt from that rule, and frankly, to have allowed them on site in the first place was her first mistake of the day. The dog eventually got loose on the site and the show had to be halted for 5 minutes until the dog could be caught. Total fiasco!

If the dog has to be on a prong collar, it doesn't belong at a show site until it is trained!

I think I saw the same dog and it was unruly. I like the collar Casar Milan uses.

Soon after I got my first Labador, 13 years ago, I had knee replacement surgery. I had asked several other Lab people about using a prong collar and received a definite no! I started obedience training, and the trainer, bless her, said that it looked like I could use a prong on her. I almost cried, it was such a help, and I didn't have to worry about getting pulled over. Yes, the dog needed more training, so did I. Yes, I now have some in my pack that absolutely will never need a prong and would look at me quizically if I tried one. Huh? me??

That being said, as some of you know, I had my right leg amputated last November. I am again in the position of being worried about getting pulled over. Do my dogs need more training, yes. However, I am still figuring out how to walk, let alone get back to obedience training.

I will use prongs, and I believe, like Anne, that there is nothing wrong with them, when used properly. I have also used regular slip collars, kennel leads, snap around nylon slip collars, that the Volhard's recommend, and am looking into using the Gentle Leader no pull harness, since, as mentioned, I cannot use a prong at an AKC event. These things are all tools - like food, like leashes, like anything else.

If you google, there are lots of articles on types of collars to use, and also many strong opinions one way or the other.

JMO

Susan

I have a puller - terrible puller! To make it worse he is huge 24 1/2" and about 105 #'s.

Well he drug me everywhere and the prong collar did not work well for me. So I decided to try a head halter. I took the ol' stubborn boy to Petsmart to try them on to make sure I got the right size. I did. And as soon as I tried leading him around the store - THE RODEO BEGAN! He bucked, and thrashed and crow-hopped, knocked over displays, took me water skiiing down one aisle and bellying flooping down the next. Two store employees tried to help and by the end of our session - we all had dang near all pee'd our pants with laughter and had bruises to show for it - but he was walking with the head halter.

I recommedn them as well - it can be a rough start - but don't give up.

Valerie - Bibsmom

We use prongs in our initial training but after a point the dog doesn't need the tool anymore. Honestly, I find the prong more effective than the head collar, but it also depends on the dog. I used the GL just fine with Maddy to train her out of pulling. But with Grace, I would rather avoid her slamming her head into the sidewalk and road, so the prong is better for her.

I think the key is training and more training so that when you do go to a show, the dogs can behave on a flat or chain collar.

It is a rough start with the head collars,they do buck like broncos , and make fools of themselves, but it is temporary, and don't let their dramatics sway you ! Dogs that do this are the ones that NEED the head collar, and it is meant to be temporary, you do NOT need them forever, they are a tool in the long line of training tools to get the dog to the place they need to be.

The thing I don't like about head collars is that a dog that is not under control that is jumping around on a street can easily get out of the collar and bolt. They need to be totally introduced and the dog desensitized to them in a secure area before going out for a walk or God forbid the parking lot of the pet store.

I'm not a big strong person and when I walk two Labs together I use prong collars.

Prong collars are very effective because they are not dependent on the owner's timing - which is so important if the dog is going to understand action and reaction. Also, I agree with others that the prong is much safer than the head halters or the choke chain. However, they have to be correctly sized and fitted and you should be instructed on their use. Do you have someone who could check your collar and fit? The leash is never popped or jerked. When the dogs pulls, the collar responds quickly with safe, even and proportionate pressure and the dog LEARNS.

Oh Gina - we weren't in the parking lot - we were in the store - that way we could do WAY more damage!
I don't think the displays have ever been the same!
Valerie

and the first time I used one, I thought they went OVER the dogs head!! sheesh!!

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Replying to:

Prong collars are very effective because they are not dependent on the owner's timing - which is so important if the dog is going to understand action and reaction. Also, I agree with others that the prong is much safer than the head halters or the choke chain. However, they have to be correctly sized and fitted and you should be instructed on their use. Do you have someone who could check your collar and fit? The leash is never popped or jerked. When the dogs pulls, the collar responds quickly with safe, even and proportionate pressure and the dog LEARNS.

Thanks for the responses everyone. Yes the prong collar is fitted properly. Years ago I went to a trainer who made it mandatory to learn about the most common training collars and how to fit them and how to use them, even if you weren't going to use them in the class. I guess I can try the head collar again, but walks are still tough with it. He rubs his face with his paws, even to the point of causing bleeding to his snout sometimes. He's a young dog and I know he'll get better with time. Maybe I'll switch him between the two. Thanks again.

Hi!
I love the prong collar. I have two very strong boys
that don't very often need to wear one. I agree, you need to be instructed on how to use them and you shouldn't have to use one all the time. They are just a temporary training aid.

Donna

I have found one of the best ways to wean the dogs of prong collars is to start using a buckle and the prong at the same time. While you are walking switch them off, back and forth until they are not sure which one they are on. This is after you've done your majority of training on the prong.Then just leave the prong on while you use the buckle until you feel they can go without the prong altogether. I had one very smart bitch who never got off the prong when we went for our "walks" she was just too intent to listen!! Never hurt her, she still saw the collar and was happy to go!!!

What ever happened to obedience training? That is what it is all about. In the AKC CGC we walk without a lead. There is more to showing a lab then being just pretty. It is called temperment. I have a therapy dog. And we worked really hard at it. We got our CGC TDI. I use a buckle collar. I don't choke my dog or torture him. Oprah just had a trainer on that uses positive reinforcement. Labs love bait. And they are smart. So they are so easy to train. I spend hours and hours at obedience class. Not that I need trained. But to socialize my puppies. I saw an obendience trainer once with a golden that literally danced. Spend some time in the obedience ring. Not all AKC dogs are meant for the beauty contest. Don't throw away temperment. The CGC you walk with your dog off lead.

I didn't do any off-lead exercises, I thought that was only for a CD!

actually, the CGC Canine Good Citizen is 100% ON LEAD not off lead. Its walking nicely on a loose leash, and the stay and recall are done on a long line. The CD, companion dog title , is partially off leash as well as on lead

barb (CGC evaluator)