Imagine this….I have a puppy buyer threatening me with a lawsuit because I wouldn’t sell them the pick male. They knew the rules-of-the-road. I didn’t take a deposit…I never do because of all variables that can occur with breeding.

They started calling other breeders and bitching to them about how horrible I am for not selling them MY puppy. They were well aware that they would choose their puppy after I chose mine.

They have no grounds for their accusations but they even called my pastor to tell him what a terrible person I am…I know them through church. How ironic is this?
My pastor called me and told me I was not acting very Christian like by depriving them of a puppy that they had been waiting for 6 months. I am looking for a new church.

At my age (55) I thought I was a pretty darn good judge of people but this one has thrown me for a loop.

They put flyers at all my local vets offices and pet stores near me ranting about my breeding practices and making claims that I am a puppy mill. Which I am not.

They also have been calling animal control reporting that I have more dogs than allowed.

There are some real fruitcakes out there walking around.

Call a lawyer.

I'd be talking to my lawyer about slander and libel issues - that is if you can prove this person wrong. I'd also go and collect as many of those flyers as you can as evidence!

make sure when you pick up the flyers, you write down where each one was posted. Good Luck.

hmmm, have they ever heard of the term slander, and that it is a litigious action? yup, I'd find yourself a lawyer and countersue for defamation of character. sounds to me you made the right decision of NOT giving them a puppy period!!!

I have 100 fliers as of now..my sons went out and collected them. My husband called a lawyer and he says when someone is telling the truth it's not slander or libel but in this case we can stop them we also called the police. The police claim it's a civil matter so who knows what is going to happen with these nutty people.
It's going to cost us lots of money though to have a lawyer deal with them. The spouse is fuming at them.

can't the police get them for littering? If they are attaching them to telephone poles and such, that is also illegal I believe.

I don't know about littering and poles I will check right now though. The police don't seem to care much..they keep saying it's a civil matter and act like we are bothering them. I think there is a village missing their idiots.

I had someone send a letter to AKC, our local lab club to which I belong, a couple of people in our club too. The husband threatened to "come and pay me a visit"--from 7 hours away after I hesitated about selling them a pup. That was the final straw. I wouldn't sell them a puppy b/c at the last min they weren't "ready" and were taking a long vacation that they said they had planned for 6 months--if so why not tell me when they first said they wanted a pup? Plus they didn't "sound" right to me. As far as I'm concerned no pup is sold until I accept $$. I wouldn't get a lawyer unless you know one who will write a letter for little or no charge. You are just making more trouble for yourself if you have to pay for that.
Ignore them. They are showing their true colors to everyone.

It's slander defacing your reputation.And littering the poles. which is illegal.But so are Yard sale signs and amber alerts on them? Nice Pastor jeezz. He needs to mind his own business.

Wow, just wow....

I agree with also a sinner.
If you know you are a good person/breeder/Christian turn the other cheek baby:)
You didn't even take a deposit for goodness sake!
Inform your pastor it inst very Christian of him to judge....especially without all the facts.
If you have a website go make a page for the future CLEARLY stating your policies so there can never be a problem in the future and get people on your list to either sign off on it either in person or via email.Make sure you get an email confirmation or sig and then even if you dont choose to pursue legal action in a case like this you have something to throw back at them to say they have no right or leg to stand upon. I have seen on some breeders sites the statement (not exact wording) "These are MY babies...it is MY choice where they go and at any time I reserve the right to make choices for my pups that I feel are in their best interest including the choice not to place a particular pup with a particular family regardless of prior agreements. In such cases where _I_ choose not to place a pup all monies are of course refunded."

I have never run into a problem such as yours, but being fairly new to officially being a breeder myself, your cautionary tale makes me think this type of statement is a good thing to use.

If you are worried about your reputation, ask a couple past clients to write a brief recommendation for you to post on your site and have a list people can call if they want more info on how you deal with your families.
As for the too many dogs thing....if you are not blatantly disregarding the law, and if your dogs are all well cared for with no complaints from neighbors,Dont stress too much as there are much greater things for Animal and code enforcement to worry about.
You might even call them yourself and notify them you have been being harassed by a nut and ask if there is any penalty for them filing false complaints.

Just another reason all of us need to make sure our practices are above reproach....you never know when you might stumble on one of these types, and if you are not able to sue them, at least make sure you are protected.
Good luck to you!

My pastor called me and told me I was not acting very Christian like by depriving them of a puppy that they had been waiting for 6 months.

As a Christian, this really ticks me off. That pastor needs to butt out.

How is what they are doing to you Christian in action?

It just makes you remember that just because someone calls themselves a Pastor or a Christian, does not make it true.
Usually the people that don't make a big fuss about who is and who isn't are the true angels
Annie

This is slander. Call another Lawyer........

ANYONE CAN SUE ANYONE FOR ANY REASON. Now whether or not they can win is another story!

Best advice, go to an attorney and hire them to write a letter threatening to sue them for slander or libel. You don't even need proof of what they are doing. Most attorneys will write a letter if you pay them a nominal fee (about $100). They'll know all the legal terms that are usually enough to scare them off.

Good luck, I know what it's like to have someone going around trying to "ruin" you.

It's just sad that there are so many vindictive nutcases out there.

Just a thought...if they do not have it in writing that you even considered giving them a puppy...how can they prove you ever even intended to give them one? Your word against theirs. No written contract...no cashed check...they have nothing to stand on! Keep us posted.

Isn't that the truth?! If you have to announce it to the world, well, that tells you something right there.

Did you take pictures? I would take pictures of where the posters were found, and write on them where they were found (as suggested previously).

I also find your pastor should mind his own beezwacks and wonder what is christian in his butting in this matter.

This is slander, the fact that he is calling people to let them know "who you truly are"

My gosh how some people were raised to have bad manners

I had a woman do that to me...she bought a little girl from me, all references checked out great, she calls me a week later, now mind you, the puppy was 9 1/2 weeks old when she took it home, she said she couldn't get her housebroken!! I asked what she did if she went potty in the house and she said she swatted her! now the puppy was peeing when she raised her voice to her, I wonder what she meant by "swat". Anyway, I tried and tried to get her to return the puppy to me and I would give her money back, instead she started posting remarks everywhere, just like your client. Well, I took her a$$ to court, she was found guilty of slander and harrassment and was fined and had to return the puppy, also granted me a restraining order.
FIND YOU ANOTHER LAWER !!!! It cost me approx $400 to get it into court but she had to pay ALL court fees and my share of the expences.
When I did get MY puppy back, she would go and hide and pee...no wonder, I still have her and she's 100 % house broken and the best darned dog you could ever want. I got her back just in time.
GOOD LUCK! at least threaten her with a suit.

That’s horrible that she hit the puppy …so glad to hear you got her back!

Last night we met with our lawyer and she said it could cost us a lot of money to defend our name and then there would be huge fees just trying to have the lawsuit served on them.

Her suggestion was to ignore them. She is going to send them a letter though and ask them to stop or else but we also found out the letters don’t mean much to those type of people. They usually laugh at them because they know there is nothing legal about them…just scare tactics.

Last night I had 2 church elders call me and chastise me for causing so much pain to a wonderful family and the kids were suffering from depression. That I should be, lucky they don’t sue me for pain and suffering.

This morning my neighbor brought me a pile of fliers that were left at our local Petco.

I’m really PO’ed now. I may seek a second opinion from a different lawyer.

I have to remain anonymous about this I’m sure you all understand. I have created a screen name on free AOL if anyone feels like sharing advice with me as opposed to taking up space on this board with my personal problem feel free. Goodbreeder2@aol.com

This could happen to you too. People scare the you know what out of me these days. It wasn’t like this 30 years ago as I can remember. Maybe that’s my problem! LOL

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I had a woman do that to me...she bought a little girl from me, all references checked out great, she calls me a week later, now mind you, the puppy was 9 1/2 weeks old when she took it home, she said she couldn't get her housebroken!! I asked what she did if she went potty in the house and she said she swatted her! now the puppy was peeing when she raised her voice to her, I wonder what she meant by "swat". Anyway, I tried and tried to get her to return the puppy to me and I would give her money back, instead she started posting remarks everywhere, just like your client. Well, I took her a$$ to court, she was found guilty of slander and harrassment and was fined and had to return the puppy, also granted me a restraining order.
FIND YOU ANOTHER LAWER !!!! It cost me approx $400 to get it into court but she had to pay ALL court fees and my share of the expences.
When I did get MY puppy back, she would go and hide and pee...no wonder, I still have her and she's 100 % house broken and the best darned dog you could ever want. I got her back just in time.
GOOD LUCK! at least threaten her with a suit.

This is just unbelievable to me...

At the VERY least, I would be looking for a new church.

I think a second opinion with a different attorney is warranted. Send the letter anyway asking them to cease and desist with the slander. You then have proof that they were told to stop and if they continue with the signs and posters after confirmation of the letter, that will work to your advantage.

Good luck... I really feel for you having to put up with this for doing the right thing.

This is just awful and so sorry you are going thru this.

Your pastor needs to learn the meaning of unchristian and take a look at these peoples' unchristian behavior. I would bet they contribute quite a bit financially to his church and god forbid he doesn't back them up - he may lose out in the end.

This may not help but if you can prove that they are the creator of these fliers and find out if they have put any in mailboxes (that is a federal offense) and prove it, it should help you if you end up in court.

I hope this ends soon and you can move ahead in your life. Fingers crossed that the letter from your lawyer will shut them up.

You should probably consider letting other breeders in your area know who these people are so they can put this couple on their "do not sell" lists.
Did you explain to your pastor how it works with responsible breeding? You're doing what you do in the best way possible. You're not keeping this puppy out of spite or selfishness. It's not like you baked a bunch of cupcakes for the church social, and you saved the best one for yourself. There is nothing wrong with putting a pet quality pup in a pet home!

This is unbelievable. I don't think you've said, did they get another puppy from you? Or did they not want any other puppy than the one you wanted? If you never took any money from them, or you sold them a different puppy out of the same litter, you fulfilled your end of the agreement. What they are doing is just vindictive and mean. If all they want is a family pet, why would they want to deprive you of the show quality pup that I'm sure you've waited a lot more than 6 months for? You should put that question back to your pastor and see what he says about that. Some people are such a waste of skin.

We have talked at great length with our pastor and explained how we as breeders retain specific puppies for our program and what was promised to this family was a pet not a show puppy. He doesn’t seem to grasp the concept. I have invited him to visit our kennel and actually see what we do with our dogs. He has not accepted our invitation as of yet.

I had my litter out and ready for this family to visit and they asked what puppy I was keeping and I pointed 3 of them out and that’s where it all began. They asked why and I explained and they felt they should have any pick that they like since they were first on my list. I accepted no monies or any form of a deposit.

After 2 hours of education this family ad nauseam the spouse finally asked them to leave.

They came over knowing they had 4 beautiful Labrador pups to choose from out of a litter of 7 and we always assist in pairing puppy to family as best we can.

To answer your question about telling other breeders in my area…we have and we are all on the look out for each other and being very careful no one sells to this family even if it’s through an intermediary.

I have given names and all information I have on this family so no one has to deal with them. I suspect they will end up at some BYB or show mill.

We have contacted the post office about the fliers and the police again. We have witnesses who are willing to come forward. We hired a new lawyer and we plan to take some action against these people.

We are most upset that people we held in high esteem let us down. Our church and pastor intervened in something they never should have. We are in a smallish town and we feel like marked people now.

Thank you to all that responded here and privately the reassurance has felt warm and fuzzy and much appreciated.

This sounds so totally off the wall! I just can't figure out what is going on with these people unless they can't distinguish between show/breeding quality and healthy... Perhaps they have deluded themselves that if the pup is not show quality it might not be healthy?

The other possibility that crossed my mind (and this is paranoid, I know) is could they be a part of a grassroots campaign against breeders? Can others of us expect similar "slam" campaigns?

I think slander would be impossible to prove unless you have a picture of them putting the flyers up. In the future, only take out the puppies that the people have a choice between. I always make sure my pick is away from the litter so they never see that puppy. Also, put yourself together a puppy contract that plainly states that you have the right to refuse to sell a puppy to anyone for any reason. If this continues to involve your church, ask your pastor and some elders to have a meeting with you and this family and offer them one of the 3 puppies available. If they refuse, cut your losses and move on. Unless you had something in writing that said they got first pick of the litter, they have no legal claims against you. The sooner that you can put this thing to bed the better off you'll be. You can't change what they've already said and posted about you.

I had no contract with them. I never do contracts until a family is approved and puppy picked. I don't owe them anything.

However that is a good idea about sitting sown with our pastor and the family but after what both of them did I can't find it in my heart to sell them one of my pups.

As for slander the lawyers say it will be a Peeing contest. What a pain in the arse.

okay you've gotten about 30 emails and they are all telling you to do one of three things. how long do we have to listen to you now whine and complain
pick a course of action and just do it already

Are you the family?

My GOSH I was answering the questions.

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okay you've gotten about 30 emails and they are all telling you to do one of three things. how long do we have to listen to you now whine and complain
pick a course of action and just do it already

I don't understand the people that come onto these threads and then gripe about how it needs to end. This is the second thread I have seen almost the same comment "you have gotten 30 replies, end this." who is out there counting replies for goodness sake?
Cant you read the title of the thread and skip over it? Its easy really!!
Sounds to me like this lady is a bit frustrated and at her wits end and just needs a little support from a community she thinks will understand her plight.
Dont be and Ogre! Be happy!

Thank you Annie

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Replying to:

I don't understand the people that come onto these threads and then gripe about how it needs to end. This is the second thread I have seen almost the same comment "you have gotten 30 replies, end this." who is out there counting replies for goodness sake?
Cant you read the title of the thread and skip over it? Its easy really!!
Sounds to me like this lady is a bit frustrated and at her wits end and just needs a little support from a community she thinks will understand her plight.
Dont be and Ogre! Be happy!

Not what I meant at all...she just asked for advice and gets cut to the quick.

Some people just have nothing better to do with their lives....Just ignore them. Don't let the sour grapes ruin your day!

When I first read of this breeders plight, the first thing I though of was the few people who I spoke to while interviewing families for my last litter who I knew immediately were not a good fit and who I tried to let down in a polite manner.

A couple of them didn't react so well, when I told them that although they were very nice people, that I didn't think one of my pups would be right for them.

One was extremely busy but said all the care of the pup would be up to their 11 year old and this was to teach him responsibility...another said that she would take one of my pups...how nice of her eh?...but that for the money she expected full registration and to be able breed him to her girl if she wished. while some just move on and probably approach another breeder, there are always those who get nasty, and both of these sure were. The one told me I was discriminating against her because she was black and that she was going to report me( I dont know to whom)...I never met her and didnt ask her ethinicity as I certainly wouldn't have cared, but thats what she inferred. Both went away...but this this poster just made me think about how much it would have stunk if either had gotten any nastier than they were.

I suppose the bottom line is that while we all talk of all the heartbreak involved in responsible breeding, we don't often talk of the other big aggravation of a responsible breeder and that is angering people who do not measure up to our individual standards for a good home, or those who due to the nature of our personal goals we can not accomodate.

Lets face it, doing what we do, we often have to tip toe around certain things...not annoying neighbors, complying with local rules about the number of dogs you have etc...it can really stink to have unstable people throwing around false accusations.

I personally thought this topic was pretty important because it underscored that issue. A responsible breeder is putting alot on the line and it isn't always easy to follow your principles.
I have a tendency to be a little too empathetic at times...sometimes some one says something that my gut reacts to, and my mind cuts in and says...maybe they didn't mean it that way, don't dismiss them just because of this....
This poster just reminded me that when I am dealing with prospective puppy buyers to be extremely clear on all issues and to listen to my gut at all times ...its smarter than me on occasion!
Annie
(sorry for the ramble)

Some people are just F-ing A-hols! People that pull sh*t like this really p*ss me off! Please excuse the language, but if anyone can deserves being cursed at it's these idiots.

I too, have had people be mean or nasty when turned down for a pup, and a couple times I have had customers threaten to call a lawyer if I didn't give them back their money because their pup, although otherwise fine, had a worm found in a stool sample at it's vet check. When sh*t like this happens, I get really bumbed out because here I am doing by best, and thinking I'm doing a good job from all the compliments I recieve from happy customers and then one bad seed ruins my day, or somtimes even my week.

Then, other times, I recieve such a wonderful referrence from a past customer that it truely warms my heart and makes me feel good. I specifically remember one day I had two families come to pick up pups. One family was in the kitchen while the other was in the dinning room with me going over the final paperwork. The family I was dealing with became upset that I would not sell them full breeding rights, and stormed out without their pup. After they left I returned to the other family who quickly commented how great it was that I stood up for my beliefs and stood behind my descision not to give them full breeding rights. They said something to the effect of, it's your pup and you shouldn't sell to anyone you aren't comfortable with, and they needed to understand that. I have to tell you, it was so wonderful and reassuring to hear another customer stand up for me like that an applaud me after overhearing my conversation with the other family.

Anyway, my point is, I do understand what you are going through and how devistating it feels, just try to remember all the good words you've recieved and know that for every rude person out there, you will have so many more thankful and respectful customers as well. We just can't please everyone. And those that are true a**hols aren't worth losing sleep over.

Best of Luck to you.

I had a man and his family come to my house to see a puppy I had available a few years back. He ended up being there at the same time another family, who had already reserved their puppy, was picking up.
The man was a total a** from the get go and I had to tell him that I didn't think that we had the right puppy for him.
He then got beligerant with me and started yelling! Told me he drove a long way and he expects to go home with a puppy TODAY! I told him he had no deposit with me and that our puppy was not going to "be a good match" for his family.
Finally he left, after embarassing me in front of my already screened, nice family who happened to be there at the wrong time.
Well, 20 mins later, that man came walking back down my driveway, no car, no family!
I was seconds from calling the police!
Turns out my nice family WAS there at the right time after all...the husband stood up for me and got in between the man and myself and got him to leave, without a puppy of course.
This incident really scared me. You just never know who is actually knocking on your door!
I am much more careful these days and will not allow someone to just come right over and visit us before I get a feel for them.

Whoa. That must have been scary.
I guess it drives home the thought that we do all need to be pretty careful huh?
So far I have had hubby around whenever people come over, although he usually hides as he is an anti social freak ball:)
He is however really big, bald and an ex navy guy so I would think anyone who saw him would kinda think twice...if that didn't work I could always let my lover boy lab Horus lick them into leaving. It works on my 4 year old..."Oh mommy, put that licky dog in his crate or I'm going in my room."
Annie

Annie