Is Simerdown's Doctor Pepper the winningest Chocolate in history?? I did some reseach recently and saw that he has 5 Specialty wins,12 Sporting Group I's, lots of placements in the Sporting Group, Eukanuba BOB winner, LRC inc BOS winner, 2007 AOM at westminister and BOB 114 wins! Is this a good dog to breed too??

He probably is the most "winningest chocolate", but you of course have to do your own homework regarding who you breed to. Not the place to ask, I'm sure.

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

Is Simerdown's Doctor Pepper the winningest Chocolate in history?? I did some reseach recently and saw that he has 5 Specialty wins,12 Sporting Group I's, lots of placements in the Sporting Group, Eukanuba BOB winner, LRC inc BOS winner, 2007 AOM at westminister and BOB 114 wins! Is this a good dog to breed too??

No I am new ..... only 3 yrs into this showing thing. I have a chocolate girl and I only want the best chocolate lab to breed her too. I was told that is what I was suppose to do.

Definitely a troll...

Think I know who the troll is too...

Grammer gives it away everytime!!

You should contact his owner and discuss whether he is the dog to breed to or not. Does his pedigree/type match your bitch? The fact that he has won (a lot) does not make him the best choice to breed to. Do you have a mentor or someone you can discuss this with and to evaluate your bitch? Does she have her clearances - hip, elbows, eyes, heart? If you are serious about breeding her, that is a great place to start. Best of luck to you.

I have spoke with a few people on the coast here about what to look for. I have no mentor just breeder I purchased my girl from. She doesnt have alot of bone. I have heard many people say all breed bitch. But she has alot of coat and is put together well. As far as clearances I have done everything the breeder told me to do. I have not decided on optigen for her eyes. I was old this was not a necessary test. Not sure why people are refferring it my quesiton as trolling. I was told about this website when I attended the speciality called the Potomac and that I could learn alot here. I have read alot of good things about many breeders and I read who wins at shows and I reseach info dog for wins all the time. Not sure what to think about the post I have seen so far. I am just a novice with one chocolate lab I would like to do my first breeding right.

Me thinks you need to contact your breeder for advice on what to breed your girl to!

Only she would know best what goes with her lines.

Have you shown your girl? How old is she now?

For starters, how about giving a real email address.

This is my real address .... rutttrohhh@yahoo.com

I do have work email but I would get into trouble if I gave it out.

If you're going to give advice why don't you take your own "breeder" and provide your email as an example? Why are some of you people always looking to argue with anyone? One question doesn't mean someone is a troll.

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

For starters, how about giving a real email address.

I did and she gave me a list of 5 labs to contact. So I have been doing reasearch for the past 6 months on which one to choose.

Thank you........

So... if your premise is correct (and it is, I believe) that Dr. Pepper is the #1 Chocolate of all time -- whose record did he surpass? If you can't answer that question, ask your breeder. If she can't answer it, I would ignore the guidance about not getting an Optigen test -- for a variety of reasons. Not exactly a Lab literate response from her.

And by the way, the reason that you are being characterized as a troll (whether accurately or not) is because of the.... well, general tone of this question. It's coming from questioning the dog's record and not from any kind of intelligent question about what to breed to. If you haven't seen this dog, you need to do yourself a favor and figure out a way to do so.

Chocolates are very hard to breed the correct way. You need to do alot of homework. Try to see the dog. Speak with others who have use a dog. Looked for offsprings at shows. What can the dog give your female that she is missing. Never and to many do, go with the dog of the day. Go with the look you like and the things you hope the stud dog can give your line. I will say that some of those "dogs of the day" are very nice right now. None are perfect, each has their weakness also. Your mentor should be of more help. This forum can not name names to tell you who to breed your female to. And each of us like a different chocolate stud anyway. So we are no help that way. I do love Doc and it is good to know his records are so good.

name doesn't help either, sheesh!

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

So... if your premise is correct (and it is, I believe) that Dr. Pepper is the #1 Chocolate of all time -- whose record did he surpass? If you can't answer that question, ask your breeder. If she can't answer it, I would ignore the guidance about not getting an Optigen test -- for a variety of reasons. Not exactly a Lab literate response from her.

And by the way, the reason that you are being characterized as a troll (whether accurately or not) is because of the.... well, general tone of this question. It's coming from questioning the dog's record and not from any kind of intelligent question about what to breed to. If you haven't seen this dog, you need to do yourself a favor and figure out a way to do so.

Before you all jump all over this person as being a Troll did anyone try the email address she gave? If so was it real?
Here it is as she/he gave it.
rutttrohhh@yahoo.com

I have actually seen 3 of the 5 dogs I was recommended to look at, do research on and decide. I saw alot of nice chocolate dogs at the show called the Potomac. Then there were some at a few shows I have attended here on the coast.
I have found that people were telling me the dog with the most wins is the best one to breed with. Call it ignorance, call it being new in this showing, call it what you want!! I was going on what I thought I needed to do. I guess asking a question after doing alot of research was wrong.
BTW my name is Lori my email is rutttrohhh@yahoo.com and you see to be accusing me of something I am not other than being ignorant to breeding my lab and being new to dog shows over the poast 2 years. I thought the people I had met at shows were nice. I am sure you were not one of them. When I attended the Potomac show as a spectator earlier this year everyone was so nice and complimentary of all the dogs there. I thought asking this question I would have the same reaction. I guess I was wrong.
I have learned alot from this formum, from when to breed, to when to expect sierra to whelp, to the right whelping box. This forum was been so helpful. It was just a question so I would know which is the best one to breed with ........

I guess you are a nicer more trusting person than I.

Anyone can make any e-mail and still hide identity....

ruttrohhh cerainly sounds like dear Mr. Scooby doo talking to me! lol!!!

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

Before you all jump all over this person as being a Troll did anyone try the email address she gave? If so was it real?
Here it is as she/he gave it.
rutttrohhh@yahoo.com

Best of luck with your girl. I am totally surprised and really have a hard time believing that numerous people would be telling you to that "the dog with the most wins is the best one to breed with".

You have been given good advise. Speak to your breeder, etc.

Maybe a good question to ask here is "would someone here really say breed to the dog with the most wins????

My guess is no.

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

I have actually seen 3 of the 5 dogs I was recommended to look at, do research on and decide. I saw alot of nice chocolate dogs at the show called the Potomac. Then there were some at a few shows I have attended here on the coast.
I have found that people were telling me the dog with the most wins is the best one to breed with. Call it ignorance, call it being new in this showing, call it what you want!! I was going on what I thought I needed to do. I guess asking a question after doing alot of research was wrong.
BTW my name is Lori my email is rutttrohhh@yahoo.com and you see to be accusing me of something I am not other than being ignorant to breeding my lab and being new to dog shows over the poast 2 years. I thought the people I had met at shows were nice. I am sure you were not one of them. When I attended the Potomac show as a spectator earlier this year everyone was so nice and complimentary of all the dogs there. I thought asking this question I would have the same reaction. I guess I was wrong.
I have learned alot from this formum, from when to breed, to when to expect sierra to whelp, to the right whelping box. This forum was been so helpful. It was just a question so I would know which is the best one to breed with ........

Lori,
You are to be commended for trying to do your homework. The problem for many of us is not having a clue about who or what you, your bitch, or your mentor/breeder are.
You have to understand that the best possible match for your girl might very well NOT be a top winning dog of a particular color. Also, keep in mind that many reputable stud dog owners may not agree to a breeding, depending upon many different factors.

Unbelievable. No wonder so many people do not want to use their names. Shame on you all for jumping on this person. Can't many of you go out on a limb and just speak to a poster nicely, no matter what? when you find REASON then jump. This poor person may have asked a question the wrong way, who cares. No need to be so nasty and hasty with the troll stuff. Thank goodness some of you stepped up and are just helping her.

While it's true that a dog who has done a lot of winning is likely sound, that does not necessarily mean he is the right dog for your girl! You need to look at the whole package - what are you looking to improve (coat, topline, bone, front, etc.) and does the stud have that quality? Is the stud a good producer? If you are breeding to Doc merely because of his show record, then you are doing it for the wrong reasons! Just some food for thought.

You could also visit the OFA website and look through the chocolate studs - see what he has produced - as far as hips and elbows. That also gives you the names of dogs to look up on Infodog to see their show results. I keep all of my Potomac catalogs and browse through them when looking for what studs are producing. That is just some of the research. Get some names and call the stud owners to see what they think of your pedigree and how it might work with their stud. Just a thought - if you can't find the right chocolate - take your first step and breed to a black that reinforces what you want in type, etc. Maybe a Bc . Then take that and go to chocolate.

Getting back to the original subject line, it's true: Ch. Simerdown's Dr. Pepper is the winningest chocolate of all time. Does anyone have a guess as to whose record was broken?

we sent them a list of chocolate studs that we like.......why doesn't everyone else help this person learn the ropes. We all got started somehow....and with the help of others. Some people are too critical of the new guy! Remember when you were first starting out all those many years ago?

That's xactly what I told her via email too. She's kind, sweet and means well.
Some of you people should be ashamed of yourselves. Some hopped on a bandwagon, do you feel better now? She'll learn, give her time although her first lesson was how mean and nasty labrador breeder can be when they're undercover.

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

we sent them a list of chocolate studs that we like.......why doesn't everyone else help this person learn the ropes. We all got started somehow....and with the help of others. Some people are too critical of the new guy! Remember when you were first starting out all those many years ago?

How true! But, there are also some who post here using their real name who love shoving the knife in. So sweet when they post but not in real life!

Don't confine your search to just chocolate dogs. A black carrying chocolate will produce a nice dark chocolate.

Taking the high road here. I might suggest that RuttRohh take a look at the bitch line that her girl comes from. How strong is the line? What kind of producers are they? The stud dog is only a piece of the puppy combination. I would also suggest looking at the pedigrees of dogs/bitches that have been bred using similar bitch lines to see what they have produced when combined with other males. You can start making some decisions based on line breeding versus outcross with type etc. And like other posters here I would definitely not limit my looking at studs that are only chocolate, I would be looking at dominant Black as well as Black that carries chocolate. JMHO Type should know no color. Good luck, there are an awful lot of nice boys out there to choose from.

I would recommend doing the optigen (and shame on who you got advice from saying it was unneccessary). If you don't test, you are limiting yourself to only A/Normal boys, and there are plenty of worthy B boys out there.

Winning does not make a dog the best choice for stud. Have you seen Dr. Pepper in person, studied his pedigree, looked at his get? I am learning too, and while he's a fantastic dog, not what I want for my bitch. And I am looking at chocolates too.

Would be glad to help her out. The address does not give her entire e-mail address. I have chocolates and have a list of clearances and Optigen reports on them. And yes, when it comes to chocolate if you don't do Optigen on your girl you could miss out on some very, very nice chocolate boys who are B's. We just can't call names on the forum.

she gave her address it is .
rutttrohhh@yahoo.com

Thanks, missed it trying to read all.

Hmmm. Guess no one knows (or cares?) - the dog who was the winningest Chocolate, whose record was shattered by Dr. Pepper was the great Ch. Lawnwood's Hot Chocolate.

Outa here....

Records are only what's behind them, and that's always money!

There are many, many wonderful and influential sires that never even finished.

I think we need to stop relying so much on titles and look at the whole dog.

Lets face it, titles and rankings can be, and ARE bought!!

Yes, you have to have a nice dog, but not neccessarily the "nicest" dog....

It's all who ya are and who ya know...

Sad we say this but it does happen with every color of Lab out there. There is alot of money behind the titles. Some were just a very outstanding dog that could not lose. Others are campaigned into greatness.
But think we all realize this. Thats another whole subject.

Very impressive previous leader! Congrats Dr. Pepper, I had no idea you held such a wonderful record! I'm glad this was posted.

Can you believe the irony? "Dr. Pepper Fan" posted a question about Dr. Pepper having broken a certain dog's record - and here we read in another thread on the Forum of the passing of Majorie Satterthwaite, the force behind Lawnwoods, and lady that gave us Eng/Am Ch. Lawnwoods Hot Chocolate. I'm glad this post was made.

When you look at both dogs they are more moderate and both so balanced. They really have body more alike than some would know. Think Doc started off slow to mature and is just really looking at his best. We, over the years have been thrilled to have pups that had Lawnwoods Hot Chocolate behind them.

Ruthth contact me privately on suggestions for searching for a choclate or BC boy for your girl

I too have a chocolate bitch and have spent many hrs studing pedigrees and matching the best boy to my girl.

you have to be able to pick your girl apart so you can find the right boy