It really bothers me when people say that their puppies are "out of" such and such sire, and "out of" such and such dam.

It is "by" the dog and "out of" the dam......does this bother anyone else? Pups can't be "out of" a male...sheesh!

JMO......

Never thought about it.

Sure hope you have more important things to be upset over

OP didn't say he/she was "upset", just that it bothers him/her!

Well, OP, it bothers me too! :) So does incorrect spelling of conformation (it's with an "o" not an "i"), prelims (not prelimbs!), repro (not repo) and not dog related, it's "anyway".. never "anyways".

oh get a life

Talking about spelling and getting bother for small stuff. Thats what bothers me. PLEASSSSSSSE

Only in America do we get stuff like this!!!!!!!!!

Drives me crazy.

I worry about whether my bitch is pregnant, my health, if I have enough funds to go to the next specialty, and whether my daughter made it to work safely. Complaining about how somebody spells on this forum, or describes their dog is ludicrous.
Who cares? Grammar police are a waste of time. You have to be completely missing out on life to be thinking about this stuff. I'm sorry for you!
gee, did I spel all of this stuff wright??? Ha! Cringe!

Actually in England most breeders that I've met use "by" and "out of" so of course it's only in America!

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Only in America do we get stuff like this!!!!!!!!!

I know there is a correct way to do it but I keep forgetting. I end up typing Fluffy x Killer. But then which is supposed to go first. ACK!

Dog x Bitch

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I know there is a correct way to do it but I keep forgetting. I end up typing Fluffy x Killer. But then which is supposed to go first. ACK!

Uh, last I checked, technically, first they came "out of" the male, THEN after 9 weeks, out of the female too. *S*

Yep, I say out of this mom and this dad, you bet I do.

Guess it's politically incorrect, but I doubt me and the umpteen others I know, who say it the same way will stop anytime soon.

LOL ....I needed a good laugh

I hear ya.

Its the same with horses as it is with dogs.

Out of is the bitch/dam, by is the stud/sire

People just don't always get it right and yes it can be anoying but don't let it get to you.

The answer to your frustation is to educate

I thought it was Bitch x Dog

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Dog x Bitch

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I know there is a correct way to do it but I keep forgetting. I end up typing Fluffy x Killer. But then which is supposed to go first. ACK!

Maybe you all think it is a big joke, but is there or is there not a correct way to say this? And no, in the scheme of things this is not a huge deal, but does anyone really enjoy being a poor speller or saying something incorrectly? If someone says out of this one and out of that one then who is the dog and who is the bitch, and how does one know unless of course one already knows the sire and/or dam?

Puppies do come OUT Of the bitch, and are sired BY the dog.

I don't think it has anything to do with being politically incorrect at all, it's just wanting to say things the way they are supposed to be said.

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Uh, last I checked, technically, first they came "out of" the male, THEN after 9 weeks, out of the female too. *S*

Yep, I say out of this mom and this dad, you bet I do.

Guess it's politically incorrect, but I doubt me and the umpteen others I know, who say it the same way will stop anytime soon.

If I'm looking at a webpage of someone I don't know or haven't yet heard of, and they misuse and misspell the lingo, I always wonder if they're a glorified BYB that only halfway knows what they're doing.

You can choose to spell words the way you want to and misuse the lingo the way you want to, but remember that it can reflect poorly upon you.

Good point

yes, exactly.

Why would one not mind sounding (reading) as though they don't know what they're talking about? Weren't you taught in school that grammar and spelling are important, and that the way one uses language reflects on you?

IMO, poor spelling and poor grammar, particularly when one knows the correct usage and cannot be bothered to use it, is simply ignorant. Makes me wonder what else they can't be bothered doing correctly.

I don't think you're over reacting at all. You're just the one that actually brought it up, and look at the abuse you've gotten. For once, I'm glad you were anonymous.

Folks, let's not let horse breeders think we're dumber than they are. Look at any of the thoroughbred websites. Their stallions and brood mares are always "by the sire, out of the mare, by the mare's sire". Is it a big deal? Of course not. But I wouldn't pile onto someone who made this post, especially with a big smilie preceding it.... And I second the comment someone made about "confirmation" vs. "conformation". We judge how dogs are "conformed", not whether they've gone to church and been "confirmed"...

If that bothers you, read some field dog ads sometime. Their dogs don't carry chocolate (or yellow) they "throw" it! Learning the terminology always helps.

? That would be correct terminology provided the dog does carry the given color.

About the spelling. Does it ever enter anyones mind that some did not get the education other did. Would you also laugh and put down a handicap child that could not do the same as another child ? Or a poor child that had to fight for all they accomplished in life. We are not all in our 30/40's and the school system were not all great. If they knew how to spell it they would. Stop with the spelling police, please. How important is it ! Ask yourself.

Nope, not one bit.

I said it before and I'll say it again. I appreciate it when people correct me. It doesn't matter if it is my grammar, my spelling or that my slip is show, I like to be told about it.

" Does it ever enter anyone's mind that some did not get the education other did."

Anyone can use a dictionary or easier still, if one is on-line writing on the forum one can use an online dictionary or cut and paste their response in word to check spelling and grammar. It is just a click away and FREE! We all should have a personal responsibility to continue to learn and improve ourselves and not blame others for our shortfalls.

I agree that poor grammar, spelling mistakes, incomplete sentences, and incorrect use of terminology reflects on one as a breeder. It shows that one is unwilling to take the time to educate one's self and is perhaps too lazy, or unmotivated, to improve one's self. I agree that if a person doesn't use the breed terminology correctly it makes one wonder if they are also uneducated and/or unmotivated to learn (and change/improve) about breeding practices. There are many wonderful books written on Labrador Retrievers that one can read to learn about breed terminology.

okay, now that we decided to put down and judge people on how educated they sound it time to jump on how they look in the ring right? clothes may be clean but if it looks out of date or fits poorly lets start slinging the mud okay!!

I continue to be amazed by the willingness of people in our society today to accept poor grammar, spelling, etc., and to disclaim any responsibility for self improvement. These are probably the same people whose resumes I see every day, applying for jobs that require solid writing skills. Guess where they go? And I should be doing what with them???? That's okay, though, we'll give you that job. It's not your fault that you didn't have the same opportunity as.... wait a minute - you might not have had the same education, but opportunity is something you had, didn't recognize as such, or thought was unimportant. So, because you didn't get off your can and show some initiative you are denied access to that better lifestyle, respect, etc. Well, I'm sorry, but that is not my fault.

And those of us that refuse to hold people to a standard are just enabling them.

My spelling is not great, but even here, the board will show you when you spell something wrong. Most times I cut and paste the word and put it in Google and do a search. Usually they will give me the correct spelling if I am even close. Sometimes I spell the same words wrong over and over, but once in a while I learn how to do it and remember it! Not bad for one over 50!

I guess I also have to say that I am one to read my posts several times before I hit send....and will usually change a few words and soften it up a bit. Checking spelling gives me more time to watch what I say...

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I continue to be amazed by the willingness of people in our society today to accept poor grammar, spelling, etc., and to disclaim any responsibility for self improvement. These are probably the same people whose resumes I see every day, applying for jobs that require solid writing skills. Guess where they go? And I should be doing what with them???? That's okay, though, we'll give you that job. It's not your fault that you didn't have the same opportunity as.... wait a minute - you might not have had the same education, but opportunity is something you had, didn't recognize as such, or thought was unimportant. So, because you didn't get off your can and show some initiative you are denied access to that better lifestyle, respect, etc. Well, I'm sorry, but that is not my fault.

And those of us that refuse to hold people to a standard are just enabling them.

LOL, That conversation has already been had!! Sad as it was!

Remember the "fat, slobby woman running around the ring" comments ??

I find this very sad. I guess, you high and mighty people, who are all perfect, can have the forum. I did not realize it had requirements. I hope when you have a sick puppy, the person who can not spell perfect, is not the person who has the answer to your need. Guess, spelling out weighs knowledge of the breed.

What on earth does age have to do with spelling and the ability to do something correctly? Making fun of someone with a handicap they can't help is way different than someone who is sloppy with their spelling and grammar. You even have spell check programs for those that are over 50 and are no longer able to spell. lol

Who is making fun of anyone?

The original post was about being clearer about proper terminology, i.e. By and out of. There is specific terminology in any hobby or venue I would guess.

I think that age has given me issues with memory so I do have to work harder to do some things including spelling correctly. But maybe it's not my age but Adult ADD.

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What on earth does age have to do with spelling and the ability to do something correctly? Making fun of someone with a handicap they can't help is way different than someone who is sloppy with their spelling and grammar. You even have spell check programs for those that are over 50 and are no longer able to spell. lol

I hope when you have a sick puppy, the person who can not spell perfect, is not the person who has the answer to your need. I Guess spelling out weighs knowledge of the breed.

Correct grammar and spelling certainly gives weight to a person's knowledge of the breed and health issues. i wouldn't take advice from someone on a forum if I had a puppy with a serious health problem period, but I certainly wouldn't if the answer was shot full of gramatical and spelling errors. Would you go to a doctor that practiced poor grammar and/or spelling (well that is assuming you could read his/her writing)? My dogs deserve no less. I certainly wouldn't be taking advice from someone on a forum that couldn't write a cohesive sentence or clearly convey their thoughts. People need to read some breed books to get the terminology down, and take the time to check their work.

Never thought about it as well. What bothers me MORE is when people tout all the titles and accomplishments of the relatives in a pedigree, but the parents of a pup have done absolutely nothing. Like having a grand grand sire with titles actually means that this pup is actually more special than any other pup.

**And those of us that refuse to hold people to a standard are just enabling them. **

Sister Mary Getitright would have given us a whack with a ruler for starting a sentence with 'And'.

"Correct grammar and spelling certainly gives weight to a person's knowledge of the breed and health issues. i wouldn't take advice from someone on a forum if I had a puppy with a serious health problem period, but I certainly wouldn't if the answer was shot full of gramatical and spelling errors. Would you go to a doctor that practiced poor grammar and/or spelling (well that is assuming you could read his/her writing)? My dogs deserve no less. I certainly wouldn't be taking advice from someone on a forum that couldn't write a cohesive sentence or clearly convey their thoughts. People need to read some breed books to get the terminology down, and take the time to check their work."

FYI - It's 'grammatical.' Perhaps you should practice what you preach.

FYI - It's 'grammatical.' Perhaps you should practice what you preach.

You are absolutely correct! I will try and do better next time. Thank you for your time and effort.

What a stupid conversation....

I find the whole conversation interesting. The original poster used the name "over reacting" with question marks and ended it with fun little symbols. And there were people actually defensive about what he/she was pointing out. Personally, using improper lingo is kind of like having a booger on my cheek. If someone points it out in a nice way, I am very thankful.

ya'll are too funny it's like watching a train wreck
you don't want to look but just can't turn away.
please everyone save some of your stupidity when the new fall tv season slows down and we are all bored again. don't cha just love this forum
a world unto itself

Our world would be a much different place if people could accept personal responsibility for their own shortcomings.

When I went to Europe, I came back with pretty poor spelling skills, because you start thinking in the phoenics of the other country. It took maybe 2 years to get back to the point where I could write a letter without messing up the big words!

And I'm not going to play spelling or grammar police and I've never made a post with, "Hey, did you know you spelled ___ wrong?" My post was SOLELY to provide a perspective on WHY you might to spell properly.

Maybe we should have to take a grammor testh and spelling test before we can post on this here forum.

I love it. Putt me downn for the teste two.

It's a good thing we don't have to pass half the tests we put our dogs through. We would all be spayed and placed in pet homes.

How about a Labby dictionary word each day with correct spelling and a proper definition? For those that don't need the assistance they can overlook it as many posts are.

Just a thought.

Great idea!
Here, I'll start!!

Doggie dictionary sounds like a great idea. Hey! I am college educated and I still can't spell words correctly to save my soul. I have to tell you that I cut & paste all my posts into Microsoft Word or an email before I hit post. How hard is that?

"Correct grammar and spelling certainly gives weight to a person's knowledge of the breed and health issues."

Where is the research that shows there is a direct correlation with a persons ability to spell/type and their knowledge of breeding/health?

I guess I should throw my master's degree in the trash because I make typos and therefore I am uneducated

PS God Bless google toolbar

"Correct grammar and spelling certainly gives weight to a person's knowledge of the breed and health issues."

"Where is the research that shows there is a direct correlation with a persons ability to spell/type and their knowledge of breeding/health? "

To "give weight to" a position means only to strengthen one's position and has nothing to do with direct correlation.

"Where is the research that shows there is a direct correlation with a persons ability to spell/type and their knowledge of breeding/health?"

While the occasional misspelled word or typo doesn't bother me, lack of any spelling skills and gross grammatical errors does discount the credibility and accuracy of such information, for me. If a persons grammar, punctuation and spelling is that bad, then it usually follows that said person cannot read and comprehend very well either. This person for the most part can only convey knowledge of their own experience which is limited. Knowledge of the breed has to come from more than just experience and observation, reading is extremely important as is the ability to convey your point correctly and comprehensively.

I agree:

"Correct grammar and spelling certainly gives weight to a person's knowledge of the breed and health issues."

So in other words, some of you people wont buy a dog from someone who cannot use grammar correctly or spell correctly???

As you just saw, i am the queen of run on sentences!! Does that make me a stupid person, i dont think so!!!! And yes i used As and So first in a sentence, may i be shot down right now!!

Jen

You go Jen. I am more interested in what you are saying than how you are saying it. Lets lighten up on the grammer and talk about our beloved Labradors.

"So in other words, some of you people wont buy a dog from someone who cannot use grammar correctly or spell correctly???"

Honestly, I would probably still buy a dog (depends on the dog) from someone who was challenged by the English language but if problems would arise or help from the breeder was needed, I would have trouble following their advice or believing the information that they would give me.

"While the occasional misspelled word or typo doesn't bother me, lack of any spelling skills and gross grammatical errors does discount the credibility and accuracy of such information, for me. If a persons grammar, punctuation and spelling is that bad, then it usually follows that said person cannot read and comprehend very well either. This person for the most part can only convey knowledge of their own experience which is limited. Knowledge of the breed has to come from more than just experience and observation, reading is extremely important as is the ability to convey your point correctly and comprehensively."

Man oh man, ask me how much I hate generalizations!!

I guess I better tell all the above to my old dad, who had no more than an high school education, son of a coal miner, worked in a factory until 40 years old and up and quit one day with 4 children to provide for, to venture out and start his own business in 1971.... he couldn't write a business letter if you asked him, but he knew how to surround himself with people he could delicate to. Proud to old dad has been retired a few years now, but the second generation is carrying on in that same business... oh, and there was no one more liked, trusted and respected in our industry than good old pop. My point, is I guess by your thinking, someone should have told him to give up before he tried, that there was no way he could succeed!

Oh and don't bother to point out my spelling errors!
You know sometimes we actually do know how to spell and fingers just fly fas, and the greatest offense committed was not using a spell checker. Big deal.