Now I know why I dont post on public forums.
As the breeder & owner of both these great dogs. I believe Most of Bluffs friends & suporters know he was injured from a fall down the stairs as a pup & he will not get a OFA elbow clearence.I am also the breeder of both the Sire & Dam of both of these dogs, their Sires are 1/2 brothers.I believe what I have learned with 30 years of breeding experience helps me make informed choices about MY breeding program.I am not encouraging ANYONE to breed to these dogs.They make me smile every day & I am proud of them both.

Well said Donna. After 39 years of showing dogs I must say as a breeder you are one to be admired. Your repeated devotion and hard work shows in your dogs. I have been fortunate to have shown many Ridgeview dogs and appreciate thier soundness in mind and body. I thank You for the chance to show your wonderful Bluff. It is an honor to be the one lucky enough to present him to the dog fancy!!

You should send a correction to this kennel in Taiwan who have a page for your dog and advertise him as OFA elbows normal:

http://www.toptailend.com/bluff.htm

Don't know how they could have been told that & they have a page for him like they own him

Most people would completely understand about a puppy accident preventing him from getting puppy clearances. I certainly do.
But your co-owner/breeder advertising him as having clearances when he does not is fraudulent.

Stephen Wu of Toptail Labs is well aware of all of these facts. I have no control of anything posted on his website. I am sure this is an honest mistake

Stephen Wu is Bluffs co-owner

I also forgot to mention a grand old dog by the name of CH. Tabatha's Rollick at Carrowby who crossed the Rainbor Bridge in June of 2007 at 14 years of age. Aaron's elbows never cleared OFA, and he never took a lame step till his passing at age 14. Look at all the great dogs he sired. Maybe Vicky should have dumped him as a young dog?? What a loss to the breed. Maybe we are living in an age where OFA is the God complex and throwing away good dogs because of what one Vet doesnt like??? Dogs are like people. No one is perfect. Dysplasia?? Good reason not to breed?? I agree, but not passing because of an injury?? Lets don't throw the good dogs out with the dishwater.

I received my first OFA EXCELLENT in today's mail. The
dam is Ridge View Frosty Dee Lite. The sire is Ch. Teracrofts Home Run, CD.
I have had a few prelims
at excellent come back as good finals...so, this was
a very exciting piece of good, no, excellent news!

Just seemed apropos to thank Donna for a good program
on this board instead of a personal email today! Sassy
is a beautiful, sweet girl, and we are very proud to have her.

Good for you Donna!! It is a shame and a disgrace that people have nothing else to do but sit in from of their computers all day and put down other people's dogs! Calling to memory CH Tabatha's Sport who was also injured and had a hip that never passed. One of the lovliest dogs that ever walked into a ring. Some of us should be so lucky to have dogs like these. In my opinion the naysayers should be seeing to their own breeding programs and dogs instead of displaying the green eyed jealousy that has been apparent in this situation. Let he that is without fault cast the first stone!!!

I am not putting anybody's dogs down. I was aware of the previous thread about Bluff but was not part of it. I think Bluff is a beautiful boy.
In fact I have a dog that I did prelims on, bred him when he was 18 months (and already a champion) and then he tore his cruciate and wrecked his leg. He will never get clearances either. I think most sensible people understand that happens.
I am saying that his co-owner advertising the dog for stud on his website is claiming the dog has OFA normal elbows. (not just normal elbows but OFA elbows). Clearly that is not true and at best misleading, if not fraudulent, and it should be corrected.
I am sure that this started because someone who was interested in Bluff saw that, checked the OFA website and then thought, huh? Most of us do a bit of research and make sure we think a dog is a fit before we contact a stud owner. And when something is advertised that is clearly not true it does make you wonder.

For crying out loud breeder, why don't you post your email and discuss this with Donna in private! Why do you have to tell the whole world. Where are your manners?

Maybe Bluff has OFA elbow prelims????

And for that matter - WHO REALLY CARES!!
If you don't like his clearances, DON'T USE HIM!!
Nuff said????

This isn't the first Stephen Wu story I have heard that doesn't bode well. I know money talks - but from what I have heard from extremely reputable sources I don't think I could send a dog to Asia.... at all.

MYOB!!!!!!!!!!!!! ALL OF YOU! Yes, I'm yelling.

Exactly. I wouldn't ship one of my dogs to Asia either. Have we not all seen the videos around or does money talk? I don't know but it's sad after seeing the pictures of this wonderful boy that is what is future is :(

Just reading all this and went on OFA website and wondered why there is a litter mate to Bluff that doesn't have elbow#'s??? Was this from the same stairway???? Here is the link: http://www.offa.org/display.html?appnum=1089869#animal

People who live in glass houses....well, hopefully you know the rest "Question"....

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Replying to:

Just reading all this and went on OFA website and wondered why there is a litter mate to Bluff that doesn't have elbow#'s??? Was this from the same stairway???? Here is the link: http://www.offa.org/display.html?appnum=1089869#animal

This should have been a private matter directed to Donna and not posted on the forum. I am a little disappointed in the people who have made this a public event.
But if you are so concerned then do a vertical pedigree on Bluff and see what is behind him. Example: Ridge View Bugs Bunny had produced (per ofa web site)107 off spring. And only 2 didn't pass hips and out of 84 that had there elbows done only 2 didn't pass. Hmm seems to me the odd should be in bluff's favor. As you can see his sire has been used many times. If you can't used a dog that hasn't passed his elbows (for what ever reason) then that your decision, but don't blast Donna for doing the best job she can and having the courage to keep moving forward and being honest. How many of you breeders have that many pages on ofa's web site for the whole world to see?
As it was said before you don't always throw the baby out with the bath water. You used the tools you have and breed the best you can. And in my humble opinion Donna has done a great job. Breeding is always a roll of dice Imo. We can't control accidents nor can we control genetics no matter how may test we do. And there are lots of us who should be thankful for her breeding practices and her courage to continue to move forward. Ok I am going back to lurk mode.

I am sorry this happened to you Donna
I hope you can correct Mr Yu's website.
You breed beautiful dogs

If you don't like what you see, keep it to yourself. We can do our own research. Can not believe how some are so mean. That is not anyones business. What is wrong with some of you. Some need to find another hobby. You are taking this one way to serious. Sounds like you have problems and instead of dealing with your life you are trying to make everyone ill.
Go do something nice for someone. See how that feels for a change. Sad.

People want the truth about there dogs. This is why this thread has gotten a little "over the top". When a breeder says a dog "fell down the stairs" people begin to wonder! That is our job as breeders to question everything, search everything, and try our best to be honest with ourselves, and other people.
So, when there is something that is questionable, yes this is the place to post it, people need to know!
After all, we didn't start the post! This forum is for opinions and when you post anything, you are open to all of this

I feel for you Donna....I can't say anything on this board without being attacked and now this person is using my name on nasty posts aimed at her...basically identity theft.
Best of luck with your beautiful dogs!

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Replying to:

If you don't like what you see, keep it to yourself. We can do our own research. Can not believe how some are so mean. That is not anyones business. What is wrong with some of you. Some need to find another hobby. You are taking this one way to serious. Sounds like you have problems and instead of dealing with your life you are trying to make everyone ill.
Go do something nice for someone. See how that feels for a change. Sad.

It's really sad when someone can't post a nice win or a new title without being jumped on and their dogs badmouthed. No one is forcing anyone here to use this dog for breeding or to buy a puppy out of him. Each person needs to do their research and make their own breeding/buying decisions and if they want to know more there are data searches on OFA or contact the owners and get more info instead of badmouthing them on a public forum. Since none of us were there how do you know this dog wasn't injured by a fall? Why is it assumed someone is lying when they say that happened to their dog? Do you really think it isn't possible for a puppy to fall down the stairs, jump off a deck, etc. and get injured? Have none of you really never had or known a dog that was injured and did not pass x-rays due to that injury???

I had a show quality 6 month old pup get run into hard by another dog, came up lame (of course it was the night before we were to leave for Nationals a few years ago....), lameness came and went for a couple of months, did prelims and that elbow had a broken off piece of bone in the joint. The consult we saw, an ortho vet at the University of WI Vet School said it was very possible that it happened when he was run into by the other dog as had the other vet we saw. They couldn't really give me an answer as to whether it was genetic or not since the other elbow was unaffected and his hips, shoulders and hocks were all x-rayed and just fine (they also scoped the other elbow during surgery). We had the surgery done but they felt he would always be off in his gait (he had been severely lame prior to surgery and improved a lot after but did move a bit stiffly on that leg). It was my decision to neuter and place him because he wasn't going to be able to be shown or do performance events which is what I enjoy doing with my dogs. Had he not been so affected I might have done things differently, not sure.

My point is that I was there, saw my pup get run into (and he went down hard) and know what happened to him just as Donna says she knows what happened to her pup to likely cause the non-pass on one elbow. When one elbow is involved it does seem like it often is injury related as I know of at least two friends' dogs who didn't pass on one elbow on the leg that had a known injury -- one dog kept jumping up on the owner's hot tub cover and injured a front leg jumping off, didn't pass elbows on that side. That dog is not lame and has had wins in the show ring. Yet another dog fell off the dog walk at an agility class and injured a front leg, also didn't pass an elbow on that leg but the other elbow was fine (and still is as an older adult) and went on to a championship.

Deb...I completely agree. I was just reading through these posts in disbelief at the outright attack that has taken place.

Donna was simply sharing a very special moment with the Labrador community and a few took it upon themselves to turn this into an opportunity to attack her.

I don't know about any of your Labradors, but mine certainly do enjoy quite a bit of activity. And as one would expect, occassionally someone does suffer a mishap. Is this indeed what happened here? I don't know and frankly it is of no concer to me. I guess if I were serious about breeding to any dog and I had questions, I would contact the owner of the dog directly. Not pose my questions and accusations on a public forum.

Pure and simple the reason for her post was to share a joyous moment. Let's face it, this hobby has ALOT of heartaches. It sure is nice when you can savor the good things even if only for a moment. To bad this moment had to be ruined so quickly for Donna and Erin.

I know I emailed you privately, but Congratulations again Donna. Well done Erin! I apologize you have been put through this nonsense.

Thanks Stacey!! Don't worry-none of these peoples comments have ruined anything for us! We are still ecstatic!!

I just read these messages, I am sorry for my mistake posted upon Bluff’s OFA elbows examination. The designer copied another page of mine so he didn’t change it.
Donna told me Bluff’s every thing before I own him, I appreciate Donna very much to share this wonderful boy with us.