We just had our bitch kill her 2 lb baby girl. She lay on it while we were at the vets with another dog. We can not understand how she would not know that it was under her. She has been taking wonderful care of her babies until now.
We are just sick about it

Stuff like that happens, I too had my girl lie on her pup about a week and a half ago and he died also. I don't believe for a minuet the moms do it on purpose so give her a break.
Aloha,
jackie

Oh Sheila I am sorry to hear this.
I have had it happen in the past as well and wondered how she didn't notice.
I do have a camera system now to watch the whelping box when I can't be in the room. Although you can't sit and watch it all day it makes me feel better that I can peak at the monitors from several rooms in the house.
It certainly makes us want to keep them in a bubble to protect those babies.

Tari

Sheila I am so sorry to hear this. It just makes us sick to our stomachs when we lose one precious baby.
My heartfelt thoughts go out to you.

How old was the puppy? I just had the same thing
happen. And I was there 24/7, well almost, I had
to take a nap for an our after being up all day
and night next to the whelping box.

Mom's do not do that on purpose! It takes a lot
out of them having a litter and they just don't
realize what they are laying on. Also, they are
exhausted! I don't know if you are a mom but
imagine having 6-12 babies all at one time!

I'm so sorry Sheila.

The pup was up and walking around and was almost two weeks old. Well after the time when we felt we needed to sleep next to the box.
Mom has been playing ball and is not exhaushed.
I wish I could understand how she not notice the pup under her.

Hmmm.... I have had this happen but it was within 48 hours after whelp when the pups are not strong enough to move out. I would think at 2 weeks old they would be strong enough.Or at least make enough racket to get mom to move. A side note...I dont excersise my moms till about a month after wean.I give them short potty walks but not ball playing.Not that I think that has anything to do with what happened.
Sorry to here about your lose!

I'm sorry Shiela.

Makes you wonder if she really did lie on the pup. Are you getting an autopsy?

The pup looked like a pancake so there is no question in my mind about what happened

So sorry for you. It has happened to many of us over the years. Moms are often exhausted caring for a litter and squashed puppies are not uncommon. Years ago, had a friend who's bitch sat on a 4 wk old. When my children were young and living at home, they thought it was great that I allowed them to sleep with the litter for the first couple of weeks. Lots of late night TV for them and a few rescued pups for me. Now, I cross my fingers and do errands or go to bed and hope mom is careful. You just can't stay home all the time. There is really nothing you can do about this sad possibility.

I sleep next to the box for 4 weeks. For the first 3 weeks, I won't even take a shower unless someone is watching them for me.

Did this puppy have a flat feeling chest when you held it prior? The reason I ask is because you can loose a swimmer at this age, the pups weight combined with the flat chest does allow the lungs and other organs enough room....I feel your pain, we work so hard to get a litter on the ground, then to loose one is just so sad....check your other pups, if their chests are on the flat side, I'd tape the front legs for a couple days...that's all it takes.

Good luck with the rest of your babies...

Should have wrote doesn't allow enough room...sorry

Sheila,
I am so sorry that you lost a puppy. You can noy stay with a litter forever - I know I used to try to but you just can't! At that age Mom should be fine with them alone - you did nothing wrong leaving them with their Mother! I wonder if there could have been something wrong with that puppy to make Mom do that. I too don't see how she could accidently squish one that size but if she knew their was something not right she could have done it on purpose. Is she a first time Mother?
Again - I am so sorry - I know how bad that feels.
NOT YOUR FAULT!

I am so sorry for your loss.

I don't remember reading if you mentionned how many pups she has? Is the whelping room to warm?

I have heard of mom squeeshing pups when there are a few many puppies and the temp is very warm, they tend to spread around.

Just a thought.

#I too don't see how she could accidently squish one that size but if she knew their was something not right she could have done it on purpose.#

It's not uncommon at all for a puppy to get sat on by mom. Moms get tired and just sit. Sometimes they're so tired they don't even feel a puppy under them.

The pup was not a swimmer.Have had those.
Actually I am not blaming myself, thanks Janice. Just upset that this happened. I guess I have been around enough to know that there are things that I have no control over.
I just want to scream at the mom and ask her how she could not feel it.
It is worse, I suspose, because we were so excited about this particular pup and this breeding in general. I suspose that sounds awful,but......

Sheila it does not sound awful to hear you say how excited you were and how horrible you feel and I can only imagine how angry. Nothing I can say will make it "better" but please know you have my sympathy.

Sorry for your loss, Sheila.

I lost a pup, whereby I would have sworn an oath that mom had laid on that pup, it was flat too. The only big problem was, that I pulled every pup, warm and live off mom, to take her out to potty. When we returned, 6 minutes later, the pup was flat and dead and looked exactly like it had been laid on, but there was NO one in that room. So while I do trust your judgement, I did just want to point out that sometimes it's not as it appears. Either way, I'm sorry this happened to you. A little kid in heaven got a puppy today.

This may sound morbid but pups do tend to "flatten out" after death.
Just something to consider before you get too upset with the mom.
She may have had nothing to do with it.

Sheila, so so sorry. We all know how horrible this is. Sometimes things just happen.

It really makes me sad to think that you are blaming the mom, and steering the blame away from yourself. If you were there, it wouldn't have happened, no matter how much people want to sugarcoat it. I realize that in a lot of cases, people cannot watch the pups 24/7. But, if you cannot, it disturbs me that your lack of vigilance is being blamed on your bitch. I feel very sorry for her. I hope you controlled your misguided emotions around her, poor thing.

What??? Although I do agree the blame shouldn't be put on the bitch, it's certainly not the owner's fault!!!

I leave my girls with their 2 week old pups ALL THE TIME! Oh my I'm a bad mother... shame on me.

Oh my I can't believe what I just read.

I have had this happen right when I was in the same room. First-time mother with 10 pups. She couldn't figure out how to lie down among so many and sometimes just flopped. I never heard a sound- had just observed them about 10 minutes before. I found the pup under her, with blood in its nostrils, so I know that's what happened. It was a healthy pup, 10 days old, a yellow bitch already spoken for, of course, and Mother was very saddened. I was trying to rescusitate it, and she tried to help, licking it and nudging it with her nose. She had not done it on purpose, and from them on she was much more careful when she lay down. When these things happen we want to think we can control them, so we try to find someone to blame. But no one I personally know has the time to watch a litter 24/7. We all have other responsibilities. And I think it is entirely unreasonable to blame the mother, especially if there is a large litter.

I lost a 5 week old pup this year to choking. He was cheerfully eating his dinner one minute and dying the next. I was right there and could not dislodge the food particle, which had been softened with water to prevent such an incident. The frantic feeling of helplessness is something I will never forget. But I haven't figured out any way I could have prevented it, and believe me, I've thought about it.

I feel for you, Sheila. But please don't blame Mom. One unfortunate accident doesn't make her a bad mother.

I feel for you, Sheila. But please don't blame Mom. One unfortunate accident doesn't make her a bad mother.

I wanted to echo these feelings as well. Especially since you will probably never know the exact reason the pup passed on. But the mom will sense your negative feelings and anger. After all she has been through, I think she deserves your patience, understanding and love. And I think if there was something wrong with the pup and she did what her instincts told her to, you will be confusing her.
God bless you during this painful time. But please try to remember all your lady has given to you. She needs you now. And the rest of her pups need her happy and healthy, not worried about why you are upset with her. JMHO. Take care.

I am very sorry for your loss. Try to remember that the pup did not pass for nothing if you learn something from the whole situation. You now know that the bitch may need to be monitored a little longer with her pups or will need to be seperated from them when you are not around. I am not trying to lessen what happened, just trying to see what we can learn from it.

Hi Sheila, So sorry to hear about your little puppy dying.

I just wanted to warn other breeders to that some of these larger bitches (like my 90 pounder girls) can't feel a 2 week puppy stuck under them. It's the way in which the little puppies crawl under the dam's armpit or upper body when the bitch partially sits up while in the whelping box. This happens to my dams all the time then she lays back down for a snooze and is none the wiser that one is stuck under her upper body.

I've never lost a puppy to a dam squishing it in 7 litters we've raised but then again, I don't work outside our home so I can and do monitor the whelping box around the clock that first few weeks. If I have to run a quick errand, I pull my dam from the whelping box and let her outside for some fresh air. I don't like stressing my girls out by doing this but on the other hand, I would have a hard time forgiving myself if she smothered one of her babies when it could have been prevented on my behalf.

Like others have said on this thread, maybe your little 2 wk old puppy died of other causes and not from the dam laying on it so try not to beat yourself up too much as you may never really know the cause.

No, you are not a bad mother. But, if you lose a puppy, it is because of your lack of diligence, not because the mother did something wrong. If you leave the pups unattended, you run the risk of them getting smothered. Period. I know that not everyone can have their litters attended to 24/7 for at least 3 weeks, but that doesn't mean that that is not the right thing to do. Bottom line-if you don't attend to your pups, you run the risk of losing them. And, it is not the dam's fault. I think it is appalling that she is blaming her girl.

If you go back and read Sheila's post where does it say, "I'm blaming the bitch"??? What she says is " We can not understand how she would not know that it was under her". This is a very legitimate question and no where is there a harsh word about her girl, merely a question.

You people that keep saying she is blaming this mother really need either new glasses or to go back to school and learn correct interpretation. Quit harping on folks because YOU have the problem understanding what is typed.

Sheila ~ My heart goes out to you with the lost of your pup...I am home all the time and I know it could happen to me or anyone...
I like the ideas everyone has come up with...I tried to put my girl on the deck while I went to the store but she went crazy so I brought a crate in and set it up next to the wheping box and put her in it while I was there to watch her and she was fine as long as she could see her pups..Now I can go outside or to the store and know all is safe...

Sheila's quote- "I just want to scream at the mom and ask her how she could not feel it."

How would your school interperate this?

what a moron you are, not to mention heartless. You can be in the same room and the same thing can happen.

Absolutely true. No argument here. But, if it did happen, I would not blame the bitch. I would not have the urge to scream at her. I would blame myself. That is the difference.

as a natural human emotion!!

Then again, I don't look for things to pick on someone for... seems many around here intentionally look for things and take them out of context in order to start a fuss

JMO

How is it taken out of context? Here is the entire post

"The pup was not a swimmer.Have had those.
Actually I am not blaming myself, thanks Janice. Just upset that this happened. I guess I have been around enough to know that there are things that I have no control over.
I just want to scream at the mom and ask her how she could not feel it.
It is worse, I suspose, because we were so excited about this particular pup and this breeding in general. I suspose that sounds awful,but......"

She's talking about what she "wants" to do, not what she is doing, key word is "WANTS"!! She's speaking of a feeling, an emotion, a hypothetical action based on what she is experiencing. NOT what she is actually doing.

Bottom line is people post things on here and everyone is so quick to jump the gun. This can happen to anyone, it's happened to me and I assure you I was watching my litter. Crap happens, life is not always fair and sometimes things really go wrong, even to the best there are!! We need to show more sympathy and kindess to each other and stop looking for things that are not spoken. IF Sheila had said, "I blame my bitch, this is all her fault, how could she have done this, I'm done with her" or something even close to that I would never have spoken up. She did not!!