To the raw feeders out there.

How much food would you recommend for a 10 pound 8 week old puppy?

I've read 5% of current weight, which is only 8 oz a day and doesn't seem very much. If I go with 2% of adult weight it would be more than double that!!!

TIA

I don't feed raw, but would not be happy with an 8 week old puppy weighing only 10 pounds. Feed that baby SOMETHING!

My pups are routinely about 10-12 pounds at 8 weeks and are perfectly healthy.

MWK

That's a relief! She looks normal and well-proportioned, even though her brother was probably twice her size.

I have records from quite a few litters and 10 pounds at 8 weeks is very low. I didn't even have an average litter weight at 7 weeks that low.

I would not feel "relief" with a 10 pound 8 week old pup. I would want her bulked up a bit. My 8 week old pups are usually about 14-20 pounds, with the higher weight being the norm. Are you letting her eat her fill? Let her have all she wants.

I agree 10 pounds at 8 weeks is TOO low unless maybe they are from field lines and very slender to begin with. My moderate lab puppies are usually about 15+ pounds at 8 weeks.

I would never feed raw to a puppy, but that's JMO.

No, not from field lines just from a breeder of moderate labs.

Raw food is superior to kibble because, apart from it being more nutritious and from healthy ingredients (not questionable stuff from China), it causes dogs to grow more slowly which is surely good for large breeds such as labs.

Try telling that to people who've lost puppies to E. coli or Salmonella, when puppies came to new owners sick, from breeders who weaned them onto a raw diet.

There are many kibble foods sourced from North American suppliers that are safe, ingredient-wise.

And I'm not "anti-raw" - my dogs get some raw foods along with their kibble. But adult dogs can handle bacteria in their guts that puppies can't. You also can't tell the nutritional levels in raw food; kibble is tested by the manufacturer.

I would be worried sick if I had an 8 week old that weighed only 10 lbs; that puppy needs some decent nutrition! And I also breed moderate lines. Puppies need body substance to fall back on if they get sick; they go down so quickly.

Puppies in the wild nurse MUCH longer than domestic dog and then there's a period where the mother regurgitates partially digested food for the pups. Hold off a while before putting your baby on raw.

Check this link - http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&A=2232&S=1

It doesn't need to be a Lab-specific problem. I personally know a person who bought a Standard Poodle puppy from a raw-feeding, minimal-vaccinating breeder. The puppy arrived on a Tuesday, was in the vet's on I.V. and meds by Thursday for severe bloody diarrheah, and died Friday - cause of death was sepsis. E coli and Salmonella were found in the puppy's necropsy results.

I really hate diarrheah and vomiting in puppies and do everything in my power to avoid it.

From what I have read, a puppy should get 10% of it's current body weight when eating raw. If you have not found it yet, Dog Food Forum has a raw section, with some very knowledgable people, many of which wean to raw. There is a current thread on weaning to raw

Dog food forum is a raw feeding cult. Definitely don't waste your time there if you don't feed raw. There is some good information there but most of the people there are not what I would call "very knowledgeable". Their science is based on the consensus of a few ringleaders. They are very biased and some of their generalizations are laughable. It was on this forum where I first heard about some puppies dying after being weaned on raw. Of course every other excuse possible was blamed. Sad for the young puppies and those dogs that don't get proper treatment because the hype there is raw cures and fixes everything. There's got to be a better raw food forum than that one!

Well, the OP DOES feed raw, and will definitely get a better response there than he/she has gotten here. There is no doubt they are raw oriented.

And ya, there are other raw groups, yahoo has several.

Just trying to help the OP. Personally, I would rather try to help than slam dunk. I know of many people who have weaned to raw, all with excellent results.

I don't care what someone feeds, but a 10 pound 8 week old that the "book" says to feed 8 oz. a day is just wrong. Call it slam dunk if you want, but in the mean time, tell her to feed that baby. The pup would be better off with Ol'Roy than starving rations of raw.

I have no idea where the OP got their information. What I have read though says twice as much as what he/she is feeding. that is most likely the culprit, unless there is something else wrong with the pup, especially since a litter mate is twice the size, fed presumably on the same raw food.

And, FWIW, while my bitch is/was fed raw-semi-raw (HK version), I am switching her back to kibble, and weaning to kibble, mostly because even with a balanced ration, I am too paranoid about the calcium/phosphorus ration. It has nothing to do with ecoli or salmonella.

Thanks BBI for your helpful response. There had to be something wrong with the 5% recommendation. I found that on the dogaware site "from a rottweiler breeder" and have had it bookmarked for a while. I will write to Mary Strauss, owner of the site, and tell her of the discrepancy.

"I have no idea where the OP got their information. What I have read though says twice as much as what he/she is feeding. that is most likely the culprit, unless there is something else wrong with the pup, especially since a litter mate is twice the size, fed presumably on the same raw food.

And, FWIW, while my bitch is/was fed raw-semi-raw (HK version), I am switching her back to kibble, and weaning to kibble, mostly because even with a balanced ration, I am too paranoid about the calcium/phosphorus ration. It has nothing to do with ecoli or salmonella".

8 oz a day didn't seem enough to me either, which is why I tried to get some info here. I received info from a raw feeder on another list which confirmed my thought that 2% of ideal adult weight is a better way to go and I am feeding accordingly.

These pups were fed Proplan, half a cup 3 times a day. The male is huge but the other female is just a little bigger than my puppy. Maybe HE got the lions share!

I'm with you on the paranoia about getting the calcium/phos ratio correct, as I share it too, but several people are telling me that it only applies to kibble-fed pups who are only getting synthetic vitamins and as long as we're feeding 50% or more Raw Meaty Bones, we are covered.

We shouldn't be getting e-coli or salmonella from human grade meats that we eat ourselves, which are kept cool, packaged up quickly, frozen and stored in the fridge until use. Obviously meats that are past their sell-by date would be a bad idea for puppy food. I realize that it's a paradigm shift for many and I'm not here to convert anyone.

Now I see your problem. Feeding pups 1/2 cup 3 times a day is feeding them half what they need. Especially if you are group feeding. It is obvious that the boy got most of the food. When you feed pups, there should always be leftover food when they are done eating. That way you know each pup got their fill. I would feed an 8 week old pup a minimum of 1 cup 3 times a day, and quickly be upping that to 1 1/2 cups 3 times a day. Feed that puppy.

Ah, ao you bought the pup from someone who was feeding ProPlan? Yes, 1/2 cup three times day is WAY too little. Hopefully, she will turn around now and make up for lost time. (Not too quickly of course!)

Do you have Billinghurst's "Grow Your Pups With Bones"?

I agree, that if you know what you are doing, and follow a good regimen, exact proportions may not be as critical in raw. At this point, unground bones still scare me, so I feed pre ground (bones, meat and organs together) mixed with either Volhard or Honest Kitchen. That alters the calcium ratio, with the bones ground in, so with my preggers girl, I use a beef mince (without the bones) mixed with the dehydrated, or kibble.

As far as ecoli and salmonella, it does not worry me. I see what my dogs snarf out in the woods, without a sick day in their lives....bunny coco puffs, deer raisenettes....not that I encourage that.

But to each their own, kibble or raw.

Well that's scary if she wasn't feeding enough, but the pup looks fine to me. Not a butterball, but not starved either.

Yes, I have Billinghurst's book. I can take another look at it. He's rather heavy on the use of bones don't you think? 70% IITC, I think he backed down on this later.

I just figured out where the 5% of bodyweight idea probably came from.

I dug out my copy of Billinghursts "The BARF Diet" written in 2001 and he says:

"these puppies will be eight or more weeks of age. The amount to feed these pups is generally between 5-10% of bodyweight. For really tiny puppies, that is, puppies of small breeds, the amount fed will be towards the ten percent level. For larger puppies, particularly the giant breeds, the amount fed will be closer to five percent of bodyweight per day."

wow, that is not enough to keep a litter of pups going to proper weight. My litters are between 12-17 lbs, 13-15 average at 8 weeks. They are also eating 1 cup 3 times a day each by the time they leave.

sounds like she got whatever the boy didn't suck up.

Hungry Puppy;

More power to you for going raw. I hope your pup grows into the best girl that she can be. Obviously, and as all raw feeders say, the diet depends on the dog, and adjust accordingly. If your pup got a bad start (not enough kibble), then you have caught it early, and she will blossom under a raw diet. So, a bad start on kibble wil perhaps dictate the higher 10% of current body weight idea (or other similar calculation).

Be sure to let us know how she progresses!!