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ACL tears and rear angulation

I am curious if those that have had a lab with a torn ACL, did the dog have poor rear angulation since this is a known risk factor?

My first girl with a torn ACL did not have poor angulation, my current with a torn ACL does.

Re: ACL tears and rear angulation

Were either of them spayed early? That increases the odds of having ACL injuries.

Re: ACL tears and rear angulation

Breeder
Were either of them spayed early? That increases the odds of having ACL injuries.

Who told you that line of crap? Anyone who believes that needs a "check-up from the neck up".

Re: ACL tears and rear angulation

LOL, there are quite a few folks (mostly pet people) who think the study about how early spay/neuter correlates to joint issues means it creates CCL issues. I think it's a bunch of BS too. I don't think there is an angulation correlation either. Big strong athletic dogs hurt their knees just like all the strong athletic people. They are seeing more issues these days with kids pushing themselves in sports too. Crap happens.

My boy was in shape, healthy, good conformation and intact... and blew out both knees when he was 4.

Crap happens.

Re: ACL tears and rear angulation

No, neither one was spayed early. Interestingly, they both happened between 5-6 years of age.

Re: ACL tears and rear angulation

My boy has good rear angulation and was neutered at three years old. He is just recovering from surgery to repair a complete tear of his CCL.
Among the many things I have learned going through this journey is that it can be an acute injury, as in human athletes, or a chronic injury - damage occurring over a period of time, with the ligament stretching, fraying, and or tearing completely.
It may be hereditary, with it running in some lines more than others. Bilateral tears seem to be attributed to the dog's structure. Excess weight is a factor, as is lack of good conditioning.
Early spay/neuter may indeed contribute to CCL injuries, as well as a host of other problems. It obviously was not a factor in our situation.
My surgeon stated that he expects that in the near future, there will be a designation of "Cruciate Ligament Disease" and that heredity will be one of several factors, just as it is with Hip Dysplasia.
As an aside, my sympathies go out to the OP. This whole experience has been daunting. And expensive. But, it has been worth it to see my boy flying happily across a field in pursuit of a flock of geese again!

Re: ACL tears and rear angulation

http://pub12.bravenet.com/forum/static/show.php?usernum=976632990&frmid=4&msgid=907378&cmd=show

Re: ACL tears and rear angulation

I have read the same thing about spaying girls before they have developed and ACL tears.

Re: ACL tears and rear angulation

The my girl was 18 mos and I saw it happen. She was retrieving a duck in water. She grabbed duck off bank turned around to bring it back and pop. She screamed brought duck across pond and came out on three legs. She actually tore bone with the ligament. The surgeon said she has only seen a few of those in all the years she has been doing ACL repair.

The board certified surgeon we have do our ACL surgeries doesn't think angulation is a predisposition to tears. He says injury related to twisting motion. Doesn't matter the shape of the leg. However he sees more of them in akitas and pit bulls which tend to have straighter angles in the rear?

Key to recovery is good rehab. Know a person who had surgery on field trial girl and she returned to running after good rehab.

Re: ACL tears and rear angulation

Interesting observation by your surgeon - that it is a twisting motion. It may very well be. I think there are many factors that converge in one dog. Conformation and twisting...wear and tear...
The rehab is a very interesting thing, too. My guy has had rehab that includes underwater treadmill, laser therapy, massage since about 5 weeks post op. He has regained virtually ALL of his muscle mass and has become his old self - full of life and raring to go. I joined a Yahoo group that recommended AGAINST formal rehab - they say that just plain walking will rebuild the muscle mass. My question is, my dog had major muscle spasms in his back. Plain walking would have aggravated that and perhaps I would now be dealing with other issues? So yes. I am a huge fan of a good rehab program.
Now, I hold my breath and wait for the other CCL to go....maybe we will be one of the lucky ones.

Re: ACL tears and rear angulation

I've had a few with torn ACL over the years, ALL had wonderful rear angles.

Re: ACL tears and rear angulation

For all of you who think it is a load of crap that early spay/neuter plays a part in cruciate tears. Maybe you better read this:

http://news.ucdavis.edu/search/news_detail.lasso?id=10498

Paragraph 14:

Specifically, early neutering was associated with an increase in the occurrence of hip dysplasia, cranial cruciate ligament tear and lymphosarcoma in males and of cranial cruciate ligament tear in females. Late neutering was associated with the subsequent occurrence of mast cell tumors and hemangiosarcoma in females.