I sold an affected puppy when the test just came out. My female was a carrier, the stud owner had just sent blood to U of Min, but was sure from the pedigree that the stud was clear. The male's EIC test came back as carrier. We tested all the pups, 1 was affected. He went to a previous pup family which I had a good relationship with. They had told me if I ever had a 'handicapped' pup, they would love to take it. Years later they gave me an update. Pup would go lie down under shade on walks, not be able to move legs for 20 minutes. They had water along, always gave pup cool water. Pup would eventually get up and continue on. They live in Chicago. This only happened in the summer but would happen almost every week or so. They only walked pup where shade was available. They'd patiently wait while pup 'rested' but pup could not get up if it wanted to. It wouldn't try or cry like in the EIC videos, just rest. It felt it coming on. This lovely family has loved and cared for this affected pup for many years now.

I have heard of negatives & carriers collapsing but not mine as I have nothing but clear. I can't prove it, so I test. It's another *tool* as many of you call clearances. I put my *tools* in the order of importance. Allergies, yes Allergies!, Epilepsy and TVD are at the tippy-top of my health list. Ever see a severely allergic dog rip itself to pieces? Same reply as mine about EIC as I haven't ever seen a collapsing dog of my own or any of the dozens of breeders I know. You don't want Allergies in your kennel and I sure hope you wouldn't want Epilepsy or TVD either. The last two have to include what some call *pedigree research*. Done properly, Lab breeders can give themselves a good edge on not winding up with those 2 until testing is available. Until then, echo dopplar testing for TVD and staying away from lines we know have produced a good amount of either disease is best.

I wish the University of Minnesota would do further studies or testing into the negatives and carriers collapsing in our breed & other breeds. Why do many dogs that are hard worked, in brutal heat; test affected yet never collapse in an entire lifetime? I don't know and the same for the reverse. There has to be something the researchers haven't located yet. It might be small so I'll test but EIC is not at the top of my *tool* list. The other diseases can be far worse and the tools for them should be used as much as the EIC tool if not more so. Remember, I did not say *throw all of the babies out with the bathwater*. I also don't understand why some breeders will line-breed on known producers of certain diseases. Just bcuz they make beautiful puppies sick or not and they only want dogs that will have a better chance of winning? If so, that's incredibly sad.
~jmho.

What all this makes me wonder is why anyone who cares about their dogs work them in the heat of summer to start with? Anyone with half a brain knows that dogs can go down from heat stroke, or what ever in the heat. Dogs on their own usually will lay in the shade on a hot day. Some won't and they have to be kept in a cool area for their own safety in that kind of weather. I know clubs hold HRT tests in the summer, and people who are driven for the title will train their dogs in the heat of the day, but what does that say about them? I think it says that they care about their egos and not the welfare of their dogs. You all need to put your money where your mouth is and take better care of your dogs to avoid the situations from happening to start with. That is the real issue in my opinion.

It's not all about heat. Heat can contribute, but it's the excitement of something that triggers many (fun bumpers, group retrieve sessions, chuck it, etc) EIC affecteds to collapse. The 2nd time the dog I that I bred collapsed, it was spring time in W. WA (no more than 60F at the time). That's what caused me to stop and question the "heat sensitivity" issue they had had the summer prior and offered to pay for the dog to be tested.

The dog of mine here that went down to heat exhaustion/stroke did so after a neighbor walked her pack of 5 dogs past (the one really liked a game of fun fence running w/ mine that collapsed, but 2 others were dog aggressive). It was unusually humid day for this area. She had been sunbathing prior, so was likely plenty warm to begin with.

As for common sense, I'll only speak for myself, but in the heat of summer, I rarely train past 10am or before 6-7pm again unless we are doing water work. Most of my competitions are located where it's almost always 10-15F cooler than what my dogs are used to, so that's not ever been an issue. I don't know of too many people that knowingly train under hazardous conditions.

Hello,
I know this is an old string, but I'm convinced my 2.5 year old has EIC but is clear genetically. After 10 minutes of ball fetch in 65 F sunny not humid weather, (granted this is warm for what we are used to in Anchorage) he has lost coordination in back legs, stumbled, fell over, etc. I have seen it twice and avoid by watching closely for symptoms, but twice friends have reported it happening on their watch. He recovers quickly (not heat stroke) and is aware and listens to commands during the episode (not epilepsy). He doesn't seem worried, just tired, panting, and happy because he is doing his favorite thing, fetch. Anyway, wanted to throw my two cents in.

This thread is even older now!! - but I've just stumbled across this forum and there are a couple of things I would like to add into the conversation re collapsing EIC clears and carriers.

The first is a comment which can be found in a recent report by the International Veterinary Epilepsy Task force, in which they state that there is probably more than one form of EIC -

"Several studies suggest the existence of another and “DNM-1-independent” EIC condition in Labrador Retrievers, as some of the EIC-affected Labrador Retrievers are negative or heterozygous for the DNM1-gene mutation (approximately 15–30 % of EIC affected Labrador Retriever) [97], [98]. Hence, two distinct terms have gained acceptance for Labrador Retrievers: d-EIC (homozygous DNM1-gene mutation) and non-d-EIC (negative or heterozygous for the DNM1-gene mutation) [30], [97], [98]. Apart from a suspected diverse genetic background for the latter two EIC types, clinical differences between d-EIC and non-d-EIC have been observed. However, in general, and in contrast to seizures, EIC-episodes are induced by strenuous exercise. Contrary to epileptic seizures muscle tone is initially decreased in the affected limbs and consciousness remains preserved in more than 80 % of the Labrador Retriever with d-EIC. Another study also reported a wide-based pelvic limb stance, crouched posture and falling to the side during d-EIC"

And then I would also like to add that my EIC carrier lab suffers from collapsing episodes which have been diagnosed as paroxysmal dyskinesia. In the early years all episodes were triggered by excitement/over-exercise/startle - but now they happen without any obvious trigger. This is part of an article about PD which was recently submitted to the Health Committee of the UK Labrador Breed Council -

PAROXYSMAL DYSKINESIA IN THE RETRIEVER LABRADOR BREED
Paroxysmal Dyskinesia is an episodic neurological condition which is increasingly being diagnosed in Labradors. It is commonly mistaken for an epileptic seizure disorder by vets and owners alike, and so it is important to understand how Paroxysmal Dyskinesia differs to epileptic seizures or fits so that it can be quickly recognised.
Paroxysmal Dyskinesia is a movement disorder and is thought to be genetic in nature (the mode of inheritance has not as yet been established). During an episode of dyskinesia the dog is fully alert and will attempt to obey commands, although he/she may have no control of limbs. Dogs remain fully conscious throughout the episode, there is no loss of bladder/bowel control, and no excessive salivation. This makes the episodes very different to epileptic seizures in which salivation, urination and a loss of awareness are expected. Episodes can sometimes be brief and fairly mild with the dog showing just a little bit of unsteadiness or incoordination of the limbs (possibly described as a “funny turn”). However other Labradors have very severe episodes despite being fully aware which can cause full collapse and involve the entire body, which is very distressing to both dog and owner. During these extreme episodes very severe muscle spasms may occur (which may possibly be painful). While some mild episodes may be fairly short, the severe episodes can last well over an hour. Once the episode is over recovery is immediate – the dog will get to its feet and almost instantly revert back to normal. There is no “aura” before the episode or post-ictal signs following the episode, which again makes them distinct to epileptic seizures in which a prolonged period of abnormal behaviour may be seen following a fit. Dogs are completely normal in between episodes and show no problems at all until the next episode occurs. Frequency, severity, and length of episodes can vary dramatically between dogs but also within individuals. Importantly, Paroxysmal Dyskinesia is not thought to influence life expectancy, with affected dogs often living long, full lives.
Some Labradors can have just a few episodes and then appear to go into complete remission (having no further episodes – or just very occasional ones), but others experience these episodes for the remainder of their lives with a frequency of anything from one episode every year to several per week. Dogs mostly begin having episodes of Paroxysmal Dyskinesia while young, often experiencing their first episode by the age of two. In some Labradors the episodes can be triggered by excitement, a sudden burst of energy, or startle – but others appear to have episodes without any apparent trigger.
Labradors were first identified at the Animal Health Trust as having Paroxysmal Dyskinesia about fifteen years ago, and neurologists are now diagnosing more dogs as having the condition. However until recently there has been very little awareness of Labrador Dyskinesia among the general veterinary profession. It is possible that Labradors with Paroxysmal Dyskinesia may be misdiagnosed as having epilepsy. Labradors with dyskinesia do not usually respond to antiepileptic drugs and at this time no treatment has been found to help dogs with the condition. Therefore recognising the condition is important so that Labradors are not needlessly given long-term antiepileptic drugs that may have little effect in controlling the episodes.
Recently, neurology specialists Mark Lowrie and Laurent Garosi began a study into this movement disorder in Labradors with a view to correctly identifying the condition so that accurate diagnosis can be made, raising awareness of Paroxysmal Dyskinesia within the veterinary profession and the public, and hopefully finding a treatment which may help these dogs. The initial stage of the study has now been completed and an article written by Mark Lowrie was published in the July 2016 edition of The Veterinary Journal

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/297891552
Natural_history_of_canine_paroxysmal_movement_disorders_in_Labrador_retrievers_and_Jack_Russell_terriers..

The research project is ongoing.

This is a link to a video which shows a Labrador having an episode of Paroxysmal Dyskinesia
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdifQO2qevg