ok fellow dog show peeps, I am in the process of buying a dog van. It will be used, not new. I have had some good referrals about Chev. Express vans and GMC Savana. To you all that have fords, do you like them, and what are the positive and negatives you have? THanks in advance!This does not include mini vans.

The Fords have a really good longevity rating - mine has over 150,000 miles and so did my previous one, which I would never have given up except that someone hit me and totalled it! Not much maintenance cost. It's a passenger van, not a cargo van, which gives you more insulation and keeps it cooler (I rented a cargo van while the insurance nonsense was going on and it was definitely a hot tin can.) The passenger van has the a/c vents in the back with separate controls so you can blast the a/c in the back without turning to an icicle up front. You also have side windows that can open for cross ventilation. The seats come out easily - no tools required. The seat belt anchors make great bungee anchors so you can secure crates inside. I can fit 2 500 crates facing the back doors, and 3 400 crates facing the side doors, plus 2 stacked smaller crates for Havanese. I can stack a Hav crate on top of each Labrador crate. For smaller bitches and puppies I can stack 2 30" wire crates in the space of one of the 400s. Driving is very comfortable - the arm rest is in the right place and the controls are all in good locations and easy to use.

Right now, the van I have has a sliding door, but I prefer the barn doors.

I would get the same van next time, unless I could afford a Sprinter!

What Nancy said, except the barn doors. Parked at the Potomac with barn doors is a PITA. Can't walk through with them wide open. Plus if the space is tight, you have to be careful not to hit the vehicle in the space next to your van.

Good point - but that is also a benefit! Take up a space and a half so you have room to work and get the dogs in and out safely. Of course, I don't park in the "extra special coned off close by the ring parking"... I park clear on the other side of the lot where there is lots of room, good grass for ex-pens, and a nice walk which helps burn off the food and drink!

But I don't know about the Potomac this year with IHG/Candlewood Suites supporting HSUS (IHG is also the parent company to Holiday Inn.)

This is the last year for the Ford Econolines. They are coming out with a Sprinter style van next year.

I hate to hijack the thread, but how many people are aware of this? This presents a bit of a predicament for me as I will, in no way, shape, or form patronize a business that supports a group that is trying to take away our rights to own, breed and show dogs. I have contacted the HI with my concerns and they don't seem to care that their dog show guests are against their support. We need to boycott all IHG hotels and send them a clear message. I will not be attending the Potomac because of this.

I'd have to say your absence will not make a hill of beans difference to Holiday. However, it could well hurt the LRCP.

If enough people boycott the HI between now and then, it will hurt them and it may be successful. But maybe this is just the excuse needed for the Potomac to seek out a new venue that is more accommodating for all.

Amen!

First of all, there is no venue that is accommodating to all. If you know of one, post it here.And secondly, most people or corporations that support HSUS think they are doing a good thing. It isn't easy for them to grasp how anyone could be against fighting animal cruelty. And that is what it looks like to them when we say we don't support HSUS. Most people that do not support HSUS also do not support PETA. To a non educated-non breeder, that sound like we are against the fight against animal cruelty. If we were to poll everyone in the country, my guess is people in favor of HSUS would poll very high. Not too many people can grasp the idea of what it means to pure bred dogs. And, most don't even care. Sad, but true. I will continue to try to explain to people about HSUS and PETA, but I will not boycott Potomac. I don't think it would help anyone. Certainly not myself.

Hate to break your little "no venue" party that people seem to have there, but the entry at Potomac (1000-1200) is no bigger than a smallish all-breed show. I don't live in the area, but where do the all-breed clubs have their shows? What about the Middleburg show site (where BareBones is held)?

None of these are held at a hotel where they have both indoor and outdoor venues, plus allow dogs in the rooms. How would it be better to have it at a place where nobody can stay onsite?? Just to make it "fair"? If ALL can't stay onsite, then NOBODY can?? But what about people in motor homes and campers? Is is "fair" that they can stay onsite, but people who don't have one cannot? So, what we need is a venue where no one can stay, since we all can't stay?? Please explain. Because your statement makes no sense at all.

I wouldn't mind seeing the show moved to an indoor venue myself. The weather is almost always a problem with this show, so why not move it inside and keep their exhibitors warm and toasty for the show?

It was one thing when the Potomac when they first started holding their show there, that most people could be accommodated when the numbers were in the hundreds, but now it's huge and although I've always stayed at the host hotel, I don't mind it being held separate from the hotel. I've attended a few large specialty shows that have been indoors recently, most notably the Nationals, and I am beginning to like it. It also gives you a much more accurate view of the dogs that aren't hiding bad feet in high grass or looking out of balance for high grass and not to mention not moving truly because they are stepping in knee deep mud, etc.

The club can still have a host hotel that has a bar and room, etc. but the show will have a much roomier feel to it and the exhibitors and dogs will be more comfortable. Oh and just not supporting the Holiday Inn who's parent company is supporting the HSUS.

Just a few options to consider.

NO!! NEVER!! Please--Never move this show indoors! I don't care what the weather is! I refuse to show at indoor shows! Hate them! Potomac is just fine as it is. There are plenty of hotels, restaurants, anything you may need. But, NOT indoors EVER!

Ditto - NO INDOORS! NEVER!!

Guess you weren't at the National this time with a nice indoor site - where the majority of winners were black, btw! And I agree - harder to hide faults as there is no uneven ground, tall grass, or mud to hide your dog's movement faults in. While I enjoy showing outdoors, it's much more pleasant to not have to fight wind/sun/rain/snow etc... as both an exhibitor and spectator. At least not for a long 3-4 day show!

I used to hate showing indoors, but after showing indoors at the Nationals and a few other shows recently, I am really liking it. It does make it hard to hide faults, but equally it is hard to find a slight hill to put a dog who is high in the rear on. You get to see the dogs for what they truly are.

As someone who also attended last year's Potomuck, and then again the freezing wind fest this year the indoor venue looks better and better. Yes it was nice to be able to duck into my hotel room (if you were lucky enough to have a room as I was) to get away from the wind, cold and rain, but I also missed a lot of the show too. The people who did not stay there had to endure the horrible conditions. Heck 2010 Best of Breed had to be postponed due to a major storm cell that moved through. I'd much rather pack and unpack every day and be in a controlled area then to be at the mercy of the weather.

Labs are sporting dogs and lab owners are sporting people. We belong outside, whatever the weather conditions. I did not attend the National this year, because it was indoors.

So you do hunt test work with your dogs???

No, I don't. Until AKC approves hunt tests with dokkens, I will not take part is the cruel treatment of the ducks.But, what does that have to do with showing indoors or outdoors??

Because you are all up and down about claiming Labs are a sporting breed (which I agree with), and you insist on showing outdoors, but won't do hunt tests (cop-out reason, honestly)! If your dog won't pick up a REAL duck or chukkar or whatever they are using, and you don't approve of it, then maybe you shouldn't have a sporting breed either! Can't have it both ways - rather hypocritical

You are so full of it, I don't even know where to begin. Are you trying to say that unless I am willing to torture ducks, I shouldn't have labs?? Really?? If you want to take it further, the hell with hunt tests. We should only have labs if we actually hunt with them, right? Well, I don't hunt, either, so I guess that is another reason I shouldn't have them. Forget the fact that labs are the most versatile of all the breeds, and can do it all. Should all the guide dogs have to get a JH? No? Maybe the blind should use pekinese to guide them? How about search and rescue? Are they ineligible to do that without a JH? How about hearing dogs? And, most importantly, companion dogs? Gotta go get that wounded duck, huh? And those terrible dock divers. No JH? Bad dogs. Drug detection dogs? Won't get a duck? Shameful. I would never even think to insult someone because of their desire to use live ducks for hunt tests, even after I witnessed extreme animal abuse when I attended a hunt test. I let it be known how I felt about it, but would never think to group all that were there with the few that were torturing the ducks. (Their comments-"They are going to die anyway, so what difference does it make?") I will never have any part of that, and I feel more than qualified to own, show, and breed Labradors. I in no way feel that the torture of one animal is a prerequisite to owning another.

I do hunt tests with my dogs and I agree, they should be held outside............ LOL

I also do Obedience and my preference is inside.

When I show in Breed my preference is my comfort. Beautiful day I prefer outside and rain and nasty, please give me an inside venue.

At Potomac this year I will be doing Obedience along with Breed. The only reason I plan on doing Obedience there is because I understand it is inside. With the unpredictable weather that time of year, it would be great if they had a venue like the Nationals did, but they do not.

Bring warm weather gear and enjoy.

By the way, I am looking for a new van also.

Yeah. Not sure how these two threads got melded together.

I was really enjoy reading about vans and then the topic went somewhere else. Perhaps we could continue Van discussion on another thread or just continue here! I am also looking at purchasing ....

My DREAM van is a MBZ Sprinter Crew Van with full factory air like the MBZ passenger van, more windows down the side and rear, fully insulated with finished interior walls, back up camera, a false floor above the rear wheel wells in the cargo area to mount and tie down crates with a pullout storage drawer underneath for x-pens, a super sound system, an awning and towing a 17 foot Casita Travel Trailer.

GEE, if I wish hard enough, will this dream come true?

Do a Quigley conversion on that, and it would be perfect!

http://www.quigley4x4.com/

Sounds nice, going to google it!

Well, I might throw in my two cents worth on the dog van. I think I found the most workable and great van. I bought a used Ford, 20 passenger van with a handicap lift. Took out most of the seats, had platforms built to hold crates and storage. The doors open like a school bus, so no lifting of dogs, even the old ones can use the "stairs", it is easy to get in and out of, and the lift is great. All equipment (like cases of wine) can be loaded up with out lifting, plus I can put the lift, part way down, place a non skid mat on it, and it is an instant grooming table. I must be getting old, as I seem to be adverse to bending and lifting.
Oh, and the other good part is I left enough seats in the van, to hold some doggie friends,and we only need one vehicle to go to dinner.

Seems expensive, $11,000 to over $12,000 on top of buying the van. That cost is for exactly what? So far, I'm not impressed.

Takes a 2 wheel drive van that is terrible in bad driving conditions, and turns it into a part time 4 wheel drive beast that will go through anything. Snow, mud, sand, ice. Love mine!

how the heck did a simple topic of dog vans get hijacked into boycotting
Potomac? so for those 3 people that plan on boycotting, what type of dog vans do you own that will be sitting in your driveway while the rest of us our at Potomac LOL LOL

I didn't realize it takes a 2 wheel drive into a 4 wheel drive. Now that's cool. I've always had 4 wheel drive out of the factory that goes through anything.

Thanks for explaining it. The website wasn't something I'm use to reading.