Hi, my 13 year old daughter has not been in school since November 2010. She had been absent for 3 weeks before the October holiday that year with a bad throat/loss of voice. Although she was still not well I took her back after 9 am after the holiday as I feared she had been off too long. She was not keen at all. They could see by looking at her that she was not well. I got a phone call at work that day to pick her up. She had not been into any classes. They put her on a reduced timetable as she was extremely anxious about going into school. She would not go into classrooms and they eventually put her in a corridor at a desk where everyone was walking by! People did not want her in the office and by then she would not go into any other room. I remember those days as being so awful, trying to get her up the road to school, she was in such a terrible state. After the Christmas holiday she would not even go into the building and was rooted to the spot shaking and crying.
She saw the Educational Psychologist for a while. Then was referred to CAMHS. It took a long time before we were seen but she then saw a clinical psychologist (CBT) for around 30 sessions (before that she had 6 weeks art therapy). That finished about 2 weeks ago. She did not communicate with the therapist at all, maybe occasionally one word answers or a nod or shake of the head. She wouldn't speak, write anything down or draw anything. They feel that is not the route for her at the moment. She is now seeing a Community Psychiatric Nurse once a week and has met her once so far. She took to her very well on that first visit - I was amazed to see my daughter sit up, smile and TALK to this woman!! She has also been taking 10mg fluoxetine for about a month.
She has been diagnosed with anxiety/selective mutism.
She does not socialise with any friends. She says she texts a particular friend she was very close to at school, and I hope this is true. Whenever I suggest seeing her, she says the friend says she is busy.
My daughter has an EOTAS tutor twice a week, who she sees at the library. For a while this was at our home but my daughter suggested herself that she now wanted to go the library - a great step forward.
She is very reluctant to lessons in the house with me on the days she does not have her tutor and I worry very much about her education.
A lady from the High School (where she should have started after the summer) has visited often and is very nice. She is now suggesting my daughter visit the school at a very quiet time but my daughter is having none of this. If I push it she starts to get distressed. According to her she is never going back to school and does not seem to see the importance of education for her future.
She spends a LOT of time on her iphone. She spends a lot of time in her room listening to music. She has little enthusiasm for things.
I also have 2 other daughters aged 9 and 11. The middle one really likes school and has a huge circle of friends - total opposite! My youngest has just started middle school and some days is not keen to go - I am very worried that the situation with my eldest has affected her.
I have considered home schooling but do not really want to go that route. I feel it is like "giving in". Also I worry about socialising (although that has been bad for 2 years now anyway) and that I am not a teacher so she would not get a proper education. I imagine my daughter would be delighted if she could be home schooled. But it would not be tackling the anxiety issue, just running away from it.
I, myself, got very down about the whole situation and went to see my GP around February this year and was prescribed 20mg citalopram daily. I find it has helped in that I feel a bit brighter, calmer and more in control than before, ie. I don't get so tearful which I felt was not helping my daughter.
It would be nice to communicate with others in similar situations.

Hi Barbara

Sorry to hear of your challenges in supporting your daughter through her anxiety and SR. Great that she herself chose to meet her tutor at the library though, it shows she isn't too anxious of being in a public place. Has she managed to keep up with her studies generally?

My 13 year old daughter is quite similar, she loves nothing better than hiding out in her room listening to music, she rarely socialises and that only really happens when mutual family friends of both my daughters come to stay. The arrangements for these meet ups are made by me and my eldest daughter who like your middle girl is very social and has a wide circle of friends. She has had no tutoring yet.

It can be exhausting and so stressful at times especially when the pressure is on from authorities. Like you I worry about the present and future social implications for my daughter. The cause of her SR was longterm bullying at a previous school, she hasn't been in school since February this year and we are currently struggling to get her to settle for even short periods in learning support at her new school.

I am new here too, I just left my intro post last week. From my experiences of support forums, finding a safe environment to share and be understood and validated is so helpful. It doesn't make the challenges go away it just helps knowing we aren't alone.

Clarity

Hi Barbara

Welcome to our group, you will find lots of advise and friendship here as we all know what you are going through.

Unfortunatley your daughter will only be able to acheive things in her own time, there is no good forcing her to do anything you can't - you have to remember that she can't help the way she is it's no ones fault.

Have a good read through past posts and you will get an understanding of the different difficulties we have all gone through and some of the ideas that have worked. Although we are at diffrent stages we all have one common problem, and that is our children have anxieties which effects them going to school and lots of other aspects in their lives.

I personally can't recommend Parent Partnership enough they were so supportive and gave me an awful lot of advise.

It will get better, but it is no an easy road to travel and you must take care of yourself in order to be strong for the family - and siblings well my youngest son used to bribe me by refusing not to go to school if he didn't gt his own way as he knew how upset i used to get with his older brother not being able to attend - a stage we have now passed i think. It is always difficult for younger siblings to go to school everyday when they see other children staying at home.

All i can say is keep supporting your daughter and let her know you are there for her - and she can always cath up on her education at a later date it's not the end of the world.

Keep in touch and wishing you all the best Sar xx

Hi Barbara, As others have said welcome to our little group, reading your story is so like mine. My daughter is also 13 and hasn't been in school since October 2011 (in fact we have just passed our year anniversary) she to has a tutor and we are now at the stage where she goes into a room in school twice a week to work with her tutor. We had the library stage as well. One of the main things that her tutor has said not only to us but to the her school is that it is a very slow softly softly approach and that daughter has to be in control. The steps she has taken are fantastic and myself and my husband learned many months ago to just go with the flow. We no longer stress about the situation and we are a much happier family because of it.

One of the things I have learned on here is that kids who have never managed to get back in full time to school or actually not back in at all have still done ok. I agree education is important but I think that the lessons in life that my daughter is presently learning are much more important than anything she can learn at school. I believe that as a result of what has happened to her she will be a much stronger person, I can already see signs of this. She is bright and I have no doubt that if she gets back she will be caught up in no time but if she doesn't that is fine as long as she is happy.

Hang in their, we all fully understand what you are going through and we are here for you to have a good rant if you need one.

As I always say hang onto that hope as that is all we have, we are lucky to all have wonderful children so what if they don't go to school

Sue

Hi Barbara,

So sorry to hear how thing are with you. I am so glad you found us on here. We really do all understand what you are going through - your story is so familiar.
It is really great that your daughter has finally clicked with the psychiatric nurse - getting on well with the counsellor/psychologist etc is just so important.
I notice at the moment on the forum that there are quite a number of kids around the 13 age group - my son also. I think this is the beginning of things getting particularly hard because they are also entering the teenage stage and the anxiety and being a teenager tend to merge and things get worse for awhile (well - at least I am hoping it is transitory!). For us it seems things might have to get worse before they get better (my son has been like this since the beginning of primary!).

You sound like you are doing all the right things and you are there for your daughter - and that is the main thing. And getting help for yourself is going to be a great help for your daughter. I am also taking medication to help with the stress levels - I really don't think I'd still be hanging in there if I didn't. I still get the tears sometimes too - but a lot less.

This forum is such a great place to let off steam , cry on shoulders and get lots of help - so stick around and there will always be someone on here to respond to you.
From others on here I have learnt that kids with School Refusal anxiety will find their way forward in some form but it might just not be the straight road we had assumed would happen.
Let us know how your daughter gets on after some more sessions with the psychiatric nurse - and even what you think they do in the sessions that helps (if either of them talk to you about it). Are you included in the sessions at any stage? And don't let anyone make you feel guilty - we all get that on and off - and yet it is only us who know what our kids go through and what we go through with them!
Take c are and stay in touch - there are lots on here who can also give specific help who have been down the road a bit ahead.
Linda

Hi Clarity, thanks very much for your reply. Sorry to hear about your daughter. Yes, our daughters sound quite similar and the same age. It is great to have this site and know that we are not alone. Like you say, it doesn't make the problem go away but it is so good to be able to be understood and talk about things. I'm quite bad about worrying what others think but I'm getting better. My daughter doesn't have her tutor today so I am trying to get her to work at home but she is so reluctant. She was due to get new glasses today but when I phoned up and found that they were not ready until tomorrow, my daughter totally withdrew. She sat with her head down, doing nothing, would speak or look at me. She takes these type of disappointments really to heart and tends to look forward to little occasions like getting new glasses very much. I'll keep trying. I am going up to the high school by myself on Thursday morning as she is refusing to come. They want to show us the computerised learning system which she will be able to access to use at home or in the library. She also has a visit from the community psychiatric nurse on Thursday. I'm slightly dreading this as, at her last visit, she encouraged me to challenge my daughter more as the CPN believes that my daughter is "very comfortable" here at home and is controlling everything. Well, I do try but I think the CPN will think I have not challenged her enough. For example, I have let her off with working this morning because she got so upset about the glasses incident....
I think it is encouraging when I read something on here about trying to accept that your child is where they are now and trying not to stress too much about getting them back to school. I know my daughter has to feel a lot better mentally before she can even think about school. I am kind of annoyed at the lady from the High School who has visited us a few times at home. She told my daughter that everything would be done at her pace, etc. And now she has not been visiting weekly as promised (yes, I know they are very busy) and is asking us to visit the school - AND she has arranged the visit for 8.30 am - a time when kids are walking to school and my daughter would find it incredibly difficult to walk up there amongst them all.
We have a CAF meeting next week and I will try to be strong and voice my opinions.

Thank you Sarah for your reply and support. It really is very much appreciated. I replied to Clarity and probably should have made that a general post as I began to ramble on about what is going on currently with us!

Thanks Sue, your message is so helpful and supportive. That's great that your daughter can be in school with her tutor. My daughter's school have a room where pupils study who cannot be in a classroom for various reasons and it would be fantastic if she could work there with her tutor at some time in the future. Look forward to "speaking" with you soon.

Hi Barbara

Don't know if you've read any of my posts but I have a son who is 15 and not attending school at the moment. I, like you, am at home with him today and he isn't doing any school work either! He suffers from anxiety and depression. Yesterday was a good day he was quite upbeat, lots of chats and hugs, etc, but today he is totally different, very down and withdrawn. Isn't speaking much just sitting on his computer.

Does your daughter go out at all because my son is virtually house-bound at the moment because of his anxiety issues. Doesn't socialise with anyone except people on-line.

Just wanted to let you know you're not alone with your troubles today.

Take care, Kathy x

Thanks a lot Linda for your support! Yes, when the CPN visited, she spoke to us both together at first and then me by myself. That's when she told me she thought my daughter was "very comfortable" here in the house and that I should challenge her more, and that she was in control of everything. As I said in a previous post, I am trying but it is hard at times. Thinking about it, when she got all withdrawn this morning because her new glasses were not ready, the "old" me might have responded by giving her/taking her out for some kind of treat (!) but I didn't - I just got on with what I had been doing - so I suppose that could be classed as challenging her a bit more? Also I will keep insisting today that she do some kind of work. Anyway, thanks again for your reply Linda.

Barbara I get told similar things re my daughter, I think the professionals involved from education and camhs perceive me as a doormat who just let's her run all over me. It's not the case, I have another daughter just one year older who is totally fine with routines in and out of school and is not defiant or controlling, as you have with your other children. Surely the effects of inconsistent parenting would manifest in all our children not just one of them.

My experience has been that the more tough love I show, the more emotionally unstable and insecure my daughter becomes. What she does respond to is unconditional acceptance, empathy, validation and compassion for what she has been through and provision of a peaceful home environment and room to recover at her own pace. The pressure put on me by the authorities causes me to put more pressure on my daughter which she just isn't ready for and which in turn just exacerbates the problem - to which their response is more of the same. The really frustrating part is that none of the people involved with letters after their names 'get's it'. Thank goodness for a place like this forum to be able to vent.

Oh my goodness, I feel exactly the same. Yes, I have two other children with no problems like my eldest so I keep having to tell myself it's not me! I, too, try to be harder with my daughter as advised sometimes but, like your daughter, she "regresses" when I do this. I think you know your daughter best and are doing a fantastic job for her. Eventually today I said to my daughter that she should do some English or Art and she said she wanted to bake! So she made some lovely cakes and then did some art, with a big smile on her face. Our children are all unique and we definitely know them best.

Hi Barbara,

You are so right, we know our children better than anyone and my own daughter opened up to me much more once she realised that I was on her side and understood what she was going through. Please tell your community psychiatirc nurse that it isn't that home is comfortable to your daughter it is that it is SAFE.

Fantastic that your daughter baked cakes etc, she has done domestic science and art today Make sure you tell the school and her CPN.

Hang in there you are doing a great job

Sue

Thanks Sue. It seems only recently I am feeling a bit stronger with this whole situation in that I feel I can speak up for myself and my daughter more. I'm not sure why, probably a combination of antidepressants, counselling and speaking to people on here and netmums. For so long I have felt alone in all this. I have been quite down with it all and don't really have many friends I can "rant" to. My mother lives in another town and is not too supportive. She finds the situation with my daughter very difficult to deal with and tends to get upset. My husband unfortunately is not too supportive either. He works long hours during the week and tends to drink too much at weekends... another story!
And yes, I will make sure I tell them about her baking and art! I think I will start a diary, which I think I should have done long ago. I think it will help me remember things to tell professionals, and also will show me progress, or not.

Thanks again for your support.

Hi Barbara and everyone else who has been posting.
Interesting reading the comments about 'control' and 'comfortable at home'. I get told the same thing. And I do feel my son is controlling in many ways but what I have read on anxiety - this is what many people with anxiety do as it makes them feel better if they are controlling the situation. I can see how it might not be a good thing to get into - but as we are worn out with all the challenges we face, then it is not quite as easy as 'challenging' them more either.
My son seems to slip slide all around rules and routines even though I am told that routines are better for him. They are I am sure - but our kids are not quite the same as other kids, so getting them into a routine is an uphill battle.
We can only keep trying but it is good to know I am not the only one with these battles.

Lovely to hear your daughter baked. Such a positive thing to do. There is a book called 'Saved by Cake' by Marian Keyes that gives recipes that saved her from depression.

Hope the rest of the week goes ok. My son has been going again. He is angry when I pick him up after school though and says he has had a terrible day. My heart always sinks at that point.
Take care everyone -
Linda xx

All of our experiences in dealing with SR behaviours in our children (which are so similar) cannot be wrong.

"Please tell your community psychiatirc nurse that it isn't that home is comfortable to your daughter it is that it is SAFE." This is very accurate imo same goes for the separation anxiety our kids display, they are anxious to be separated from perhaps the one person who does 'get it' and be forced to do things they just cannot do - all their choices taken away or at best limited in an environment which scares the hell out of them.

A supportive friend of mine shared an analogy which made a lot of sense. If a child was badly bitten by a dog and bore the scars of that on their face or body, then it would be understood without exception when that child (or future adult) saw a dog and showed extreme anxiety and fear, even if the approaching dog was gentle and friendly. For our kids - school is the dog, and for what ever reason our children feel 'bitten' by it. The scars are psychological and emotional not physical, though I believe an SR's control of sleeping and eating habits is an attempt to make the scars visible to those who can't see them.

For my daughter it was 18months of being the target of a hate campaign led by one very nasty and manipulative girl. The 'bite' went septic because her educators did not put a stop to the abuse, in fact in their denial of it they enabled it to continue. The cause of her wounds are clear as day to me or anyone who cares enough to look a little deeper (our GP, my anti bullying counsellor) but from my experience the majority of 'support' out there only exacerbates the problems of SR.

I don't know about any of you, but I am good at getting my point across on paper but when in a stressful situation where professionals are joining forces with a very tunnelled point of view, my brain goes to mush - or I feel I have to appear level and rational, at least listening to and trying their advice. When I do speak out, my words often get twisted against me - protecting my daughter becomes - over-protective, fixing and rescuing. My daughter's distress and behaviours are put down to over-sensitivity and control tactics.

It is no wonder we feel so isolated at times. As I keep saying since I found this forum, I am so glad it is here so we can support and validate each other

I totally agree with everything you say Clarity. I am going up to the school tomorrow to look at the computerised learning system and my daughter is refusing to go. I asked her again today. And, as advised by my counsellor, I probed further. I asked her if it was because it would make her anxious - she shook her head. I gently asked why she thought she didn't want to go - she said "I just don't want to". She was getting more and more agitated, head down, frowning, foot wagging quickly, the usual signs.
We don't know what it was that started this. My daughter says she was not bullied, that there was no child or adult at school that affected it. She says it wasn't the work. I've tried to think of everything. I know she worries about maths - could that be it? I used to worry about speaking aloud in class at school - could that be it? There was one girl in her circle of friends who wasn't very nice - could that be it? She mentioned that some girls said she looked "Chinese" with her hair up (she doesn't but if she did it wouldn't matter!) - could that be it? Her Grandad died 6 months before it all happened - could that be it? We just don't know, and she says she doesn't know.
I also have the CPN visiting tomorrow so I'll let you know how that goes.

Hi, Barbara,

We too went through all kinds of ideas about the cause when this first happened to my daughter we eventually realised that it was not only the shock of going from primary to secondary school but also because daughters best friend who she trusted totally and depended on left her when they got to secondary school. Daughter had other friends but not one that she totally trusted as this takes her a long time to build up. Even now she says all she wants is a best friend that she can trust and rely on.

Her tutor says it like she has gone through a bereavment.

Sue

Hi Sue, that's really interesting. My daughter did have a best friend at first school (here, we have first school 4-8, middle school 9-13 and high school 13 onwards). She left in year 3 and I remember my daughter cried hysterically for literally about 2 hours - it was awful. On starting middle school they used to arrange to meet up in the morning and then drifted apart as each made new friends. I think the start of them not being friends anymore was when the other girl didn't wait for her one morning. My daughter was extremely anxious about starting middle school and this upset her greatly. Yes, that could well be another factor, although she does have one lovely best friend from middle school who, she says, she texts regularly. I'll write more later about my visit to the school today!

I visited my daughter's school yesterday - although she has never been there yet (high school which she should have started after the summer). My daughter had been invited to go too but I couldn't get her to go, which didn't surprise me. They gave me login details for my daughter to use 2 computerised learning systems, Edlounge and Bevle. She will have lessons put on there for her that she can do at home. Also she will get this marked and receive certificates. She can also look at school notices, what work each class is doing and "chat" to "Classmates". Sounds really good and hopefully will keep her busy. Our computer is in the room we call the "office", however, and she refuses to work in there. I think it is because it used to be her Grandad's bedroom (although she denies this). He died in 2010. I think we will have to go to the library each day to do the work. For the Edlounge she has to do 2 hours a day (not necessarily all at once) in order to get it marked and get certificates.
I met with 3 teachers at the school, who were very understanding, and would like to arrange for my daughter to visit the school at a quiet time. She is refusing but we will keep trying. The woman who told my daughter she would visit her weekly said that it is now too difficult to get away from school, too busy....This is very unfortunate because I really think that would have helped.
I told my daughter about the visit and the computerised learning. She seemed to listen, smiled, then went upstairs! The school had also given me a lunch cash/swipe card for her, with her name on it, which I gave her. I said that obviously she wouldn't be using it at the moment but everyone had been given one and they thought she might like it. Not sure how that went down.
I also had a visit from the CPN yesterday. My daughter had engaged with her brilliantly the first time they met but yesterday she would not come down from her bedroom. The CPN was fine with this and talked to me for quite a while. I told her that my daughter had had quite a bad morning, which she had. My mum was visiting and we had gone to the shops with her (always feel guilty doing that when she is not at school). My mum had bought her a top. We then went into a cafe. My daughter changed mood. She had a cake but just picked at it. Her head was down, she looked sad/serious/worried, and her hands were shaking. At first me and my mum just chatted to one another but as we were leaving (I hurried this up), I asked what was wrong. She wouldn't reply at first but then said really quietly "I don't want the top". Simple as that. We returned it and assured her not to worry about things like that, it was no problem, nobody was going to mind or be cross.
She really does take little things like that very seriously and worries and finds it really difficult to communicate certain things.
So, I think not wanting to see the CPN was a combination of things: me visiting school, the top incident and just the CPN visit itself. Maybe she saw it as interrupting "nana time"?
Anyway, that afternoon she came down from her room and said she had tidied it and would we go up and look. Well, I didn't recognise her room - I hadn't seen the floor for ages and she had rearranged some furniture. She spent the rest of the day and night in a good mood.
The CPN would like me to discourage my daughter from working in her bedroom, as she currently wants to. She said a lot of kids do homework in their bedrooms at a desk but, for my daughter, she is isolating herself too much. I know this will be difficult. What do other people think of this?

Hi Barbara

Don't know what other people think, but I would say as long as she is doing some work why is there a problem "where" she is doing it. If she does some work, even if it's in her room, she should be praised for doing it. I know that our children are at risk of isolating themselves but I would be over the moon if my son had the enthusiasm to do his work, wherever!

I think we worry too much about what other people think and we should do what makes our children feel less anxious and what they are comfortable with. It's not worth the conflict! Why upset both her and yourself over this?

xx